Commonwealth v. Read — Trial ArchiveMatthew Kelly — Direct/Cross
503 linesWhereupon, MATTHEW KELLY having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified under oath as follows:
JUDGE CANNONE: Good morning.
MR. KELLY: Good morning.
JUDGE CANNONE: So you can sit or stand, however you are comfortable. All right, Mr. Lally. When you're ready.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. LALLY:
MR. LALLY: Good morning, sir.
MR. KELLY: Good morning.
MR. LALLY: Could you please state your name and spell your last name for the record?
MR. KELLY: Sure. Matthew Kelly, K-E-L-L-Y.
MR. LALLY: And what is it that you do for work, sir?
MR. KELLY: I am a firefighter/paramedic for Canton Fire.
MR. LALLY: And how long have you been a firefighter/paramedic with Canton Fire?
MR. KELLY: Approximately two and a half years.
MR. LALLY: And, prior to working for the Canton Fire Department, what, if any, other employment did you have within that sort of field?
MR. KELLY: I worked for a private ambulance group, Brewster Ambulance Service for approximately five months.
MR. LALLY: And sort of geographically, where was that located?
MR. KELLY: Boston area.
MR. LALLY: Now, prior to you working as an EMT or paramedic, you worked as an EMT before working as a paramedic?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And so prior to working as either an EMT ora paramedic, did you have any sort of training, or did you receive any sort of certification in regards to being an EMT/paramedic?
MR. KELLY: Yes. So I had to do a six-month EMT course, and then I had to do a practical and written exam for the course and then for the state to get my EMT. And then for paramedic school, it was about a 10-to-12 month didactic portion. And then I did I believe it was 200 hours clinical in the hospitals. And then I did 300 hours ride time. And then I had to doa practical and written exam for the course and also for the state. And now with Canton Fire, I'm getting precepted as a paramedic.
MR. LALLY: And, when you use that term as far as "precepted," what exactly does that term mean within your field?
MR. KELLY: It just means that you get trained by an experienced paramedic for an extended period of time until they say that you can do the job on your own.
MR. LALLY: And, with regard to being an EMT anda paramedic, do you receive a certification in regard to working within that field?
MR. KELLY: Can you say that again?
MR. LALLY: Sure. With regard to being an EMT anda paramedic, do you receive some sort of certification either from the state or some other body in regard to working in that field?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you have certification in regard to both?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And is that certification up to date at this point?
MR. KELLY: Yes, it is.
MR. LALLY: Sir, if I could turn your attention to January 28th, the evening of that, into January 29th, 2022. Were you working with the Canton Fire Department that day?
MR. KELLY: Yes, I was.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall what kind of shift you were working on that day?
MR. KELLY: Twenty-four shift on the ambulance.
MR. LALLY: Which station house were you assigned to on that day?
MR. KELLY: Station 1.
MR. LALLY: And that's located where within the town of Canton?
MR. KELLY: 99 Revere Street.
MR. LALLY: And you were assigned to the ambulance; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And who, if anyone else, from your department was assigned to the ambulance along with you?
MR. KELLY: Paramedic Anthony Flematti.
MR. LALLY: And, on that morning of January 29th, do you recall about what time that you woke up on that day?
MR. KELLY: I believe it was about 4:45 a.m.
MR. LALLY: And, when you woke up, what, if anything, is it that you did with regard to your duties and responsibilities around Fire Station House 1?
MR. KELLY: So we woke up a little bit early to shovel off the apron, shovel off the parking lot and just prepare for the new shift coming in.
MR. LALLY: And, just briefly, sir, when you go outside to shovel, what, if anything, do you recall about sort of the weather conditions and what they were at that point?
MR. KELLY: There was snow on the ground. It was snowing, high winds, low visibility, still dark out.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall being dispatched to a call shortly after 6:00 a.m.?
MR. KELLY: Yes, I do.
MR. LALLY: And what was that call or what was that dispatch in regard to and where specifically were you dispatched to?
MR. KELLY: It was an unresponsive male in the snow on Fairview Road.
MR. LALLY: And that area of Fairview Road, through your work with the Canton Fire Department, are you familiar with that specific area?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Okay. And you respond in the ambulance; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And who, if anyone, goes along in the ambulance with you?
MR. KELLY: Flematti was in the passenger seat and then Paramedic Tim Nuttall was in the back.
MR. LALLY: Okay. And who was driving?
MR. KELLY: I was driving.
MR. LALLY: And, in addition to the ambulance, Ambulance 1 that you were in, what other sort of vehicles or apparatus responded from your station to Fairview Road?
MR. KELLY: We also had an engine and our shift commander SUV.
MR. LALLY: And, if you recall, who was the shift commander in the SUV?
MR. KELLY: The shift commander was Captain Wendell Robery at the time.
MR. LALLY: And Captain Robery is now the chief of the Canton Fire; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And, as far as the engine was concerned, who, if anyone, was assigned to the engine responding to the calls?
MR. KELLY: It was Lieutenant Greg Woodbury, Firefighter/paramedic Katie McLaughlin and Firefighter/paramedic Frank Walsh.
MR. LALLY: And, as you're driving from the station house to Fairview, what, if anything, do you recall about the weather conditions, visibility, anything like that along your way?
MR. KELLY: Just heavy snow and wind, real low visibility. There was as lot of snow on the ground. So I was just trying to take it slow so we didn't spin out or drift or anything like that.
MR. LALLY: And can you describe for the jury sort of the route that you took from the station on Revere Street to Fairview Road that morning?
MR. KELLY: Yes. We took a right onto Revere Street, left onto Sherman Street, right onto Chapman Street and then a left onto Fairview.
MR. LALLY: And, as you're driving down Fairview, what, if anything, can you tell the jury about sort of the elevation of that roadway as you go from Chapman down to where you stopped eventually?
MR. KELLY: It was a pretty steep, long road downhill. It was probably downhill for half of the way through Fairview. And, because of that, I was just trying to go real slow so we didn't drift down the hill.
MR. LALLY: One last question about driving. But, as you're driving along, what, if any, else did you observe as far as sort of other vehicular traffic on the roadway, any other cars, trucks, anything like that?
MR. KELLY: Nothing until I saw the police cruiser at the scene.
MR. LALLY: And so as you're approaching the scene and you're driving towards it, what, if anything, sort of first draws your attention to where you're going and where you're stopped?
MR. KELLY: So it was just real low visibility, but we could see blue lights at times. So just kept going toward the blue lights and knew that it would be in that area.
MR. LALLY: Now, do you -- where do you stop in relation to the cruiser?
MR. KELLY: I believe they were facing towards us. So we would be in front of them.
MR. LALLY: And, at some point, you are being dispatched for an unresponsive male party, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And so when you're pulling up to the scene and you see the cruiser, are you able to also see any sort of unresponsive male party?
MR. KELLY: Not when I'm in the truck. I had to get out of the truck to see.
MR. LALLY: And when was it and how far away from it were you at the first time that you observe the unresponsive male?
MR. KELLY: Once I got out of the truck, I probably had to be about five feet away until I could see the victim.
MR. LALLY: And, at this time when you're arriving sometime shortly after 6:00 a.m., is it light out, dark out or something else?
MR. KELLY: It's dark.
MR. LALLY: Just so we can stop saying "unresponsive male," at some point you identify who the patient was that you eventually treated and transported?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And who did you identify him to be?
MR. KELLY: Mr. O'Keefe.
MR. LALLY: That would be John O'Keefe; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: So you get out of the vehicle. You all get out at the same time; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Relatively, yeah.
MR. LALLY: And where is it that you, Firefighter Flematti and Firefighter Nuttall go?
MR. KELLY: So we first go to pick up some of the bags and stuff that we'd need to conduct an arrest. And then we just go straight over to the body and some people that were around there.
MR. LALLY: And, with regard to the bags that you retrieved, what kind of bags are we talking about?
MR. KELLY: We take like a first-in bag that has miscellaneous stuff. We take an airway bag, and we would take a cardiac monitor.
MR. LALLY: And, when you indicate as far as where Mr. O'Keefe was, who, if anyone else, or what, if any other, people were in that same area?
MR. KELLY: Could you say it one more time?
MR. LALLY: Sure. When you first go over to where Mr. O'Keefe is, who, if anyone, or how many other people are in that general area when you get over there?
MR. KELLY: Sure. I remember seeing a police officer and two women.
MR. LALLY: And, as far as where Mr. O'Keefe was, first of all, how was he positioned in relation to the ground?
MR. KELLY: He was on his back, probably about -- around a fire hydrant, probably five or so feet from what I saw would be the street.
MR. LALLY: So you believed about five or so feet in from the roadway, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Now, with regard to Mr. O'Keefe when you first come over, what, if anything, did you observe as far as snow on him or around him or in the area where he was?
MR. KELLY: I don't really recall.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall how Mr. O'Keefe was dressed when you first get over there?
MR. KELLY: I believe he was wearing a hoodie, like a sweatshirt, and jeans, and I remember he had one shoe on. I forget which shoe it was.
MR. LALLY: So you don't recall which shoe it was, but there was one shoe on his foot at that point?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: So when you first arrive at this patient, at Mr. O'Keefe, what is it that you and the other firefighters are doing in regard to treatment at that point?
MR. KELLY: So the other firefighters were checking for a pulse, and then after that, we -- well, I was getting some supplies, and then we would start compressions and start moving him into the ambulance so we could get a better look at him and what we were doing.
MR. LALLY: When you say "Start compressions," what kind of compressions are you referring to?
MR. KELLY: CPR.
MR. LALLY: So chest compressions; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And, based on your training and experience, is there some sort of protocol as to how long one individual should be doing chest compressions?
MR. KELLY: So we want early and continuous chest compressions for as long as the person is pulseless. We will take breaks in order to check for a pulse and check for rhythm, any rhythm changes.
MR. LALLY: And so when breaks are taken, is that one person that's doing those same compressions the entire time or is it switched off or something else?
MR. KELLY: We try to switch off every few minutes.
MR. LALLY: Now, when you first approach where Mr. O'Keefe is on the ground, what, if any, sort of injuries, if at all, did you observe on Mr. O'Keefe at that time?
MR. KELLY: On the ground, I didn't observe any injuries or recall seeing any injuries at the time. It wasn't until we got him in the ambulance that I saw some injuries.
MR. LALLY: And so from that sort of initial assessment and initial sort of treatment of the patient, what exactly does that sort of assessment and treatment consist of when Mr. O'Keefe is on the ground?
MR. KELLY: Basically, just checking for breathing and if he has a pulse. It was pretty dark and very low visibility. So we wanted to get him out of the conditions and into the ambulance to kind of further assess him.
MR. LALLY: And, from your sort of initial assessment, did he have a pulse and was he breathing?
MR. KELLY: No.
MR. LALLY: And so you want to get him out of the conditions. And how was that accomplished?
MR. KELLY: I believe we used a scoop board or a scoop stretcher. It's just a backboard that breaks into two pieces that you can slide underneath the victim or the patient. We use that and then we had picked him up and put him onto our actual EMS stretcher and then just put the stretcher into the ambulance.
MR. LALLY: And where was the stretcher sort of placed in regard to where or in relation to where Mr. O'Keefe was five feet off the roadway?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. LALLY: Now, once you get to the entrance, what, if any, difference did you notice between sort of the lighting in the ambulance versus the lighting outside on the lawn?
MR. KELLY: So there was very low visibility outside. There was great visibility inside. There was lighting all around the back of the ambulance.
MR. LALLY: And so once you're in the back of the ambulance, what, if anything, did you observe or note at that point in regard to any injuries you observed to Mr. O'Keefe?
MR. KELLY: He had like a swollen, black and blue right eye and he had some blood around his mouth.
MR. LALLY: Now, as far as Mr. O'Keefe was concerned, during treatment, obviously you're touching or making contact with Mr. O'Keefe's body, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And, during the course of that, what, if any, observations or what, if anything, did you note in regard to sort of tactile observations of Mr. O'Keefe?
MR. KELLY: He was very cold to touch, very stiff, almost frozen like.
MR. LALLY: Now, at some point during the course of your treatment in the back of the ambulance, are his clothes removed?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And is that -- why is that?
MR. KELLY: It's just so we can try to examine his whole body for any other injuries.
MR. LALLY: And there's some concern for cardiac arrest, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Can you explain how you -- are you familiar with that term?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Can you explain to the jury what your understanding based on your training and experience is as what is cardiac arrest?
MR. KELLY: Sure. It would be when a person has a lethal cardiac rhythm where they no longer have a pulse.
MR. LALLY: Once -- the clothes, as far as being removed, how are they, physically sort of how are they, removed?
MR. KELLY: I believe they were probably cut off with trauma shears.
MR. LALLY: And, once the clothes are removed with the trauma shears, what, if any, additional injuries did you make to Mr. O'Keefe's body?
MR. KELLY: There were some lacerations on his right upper extremity.
MR. LALLY: Now, the chest compressions that you were talking about, was that continuous sort of throughout the patient care with respect to Mr. O'Keefe?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And, in addition to that, what, if anything was done with respect to body temperature for Mr. O'Keefe once in the back of the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: So we did some rewarming. So we did heat, blankets and warm clothes.
MR. LALLY: And, as the chest compressions continue in the back of the ambulance, what, if anything, did you observe with regard to Mr. O'Keefe's nose or mouth?
MR. KELLY: I remember that there was some kind of -- some blood or vomit or bile coming out of his mouth.
MR. LALLY: Now, turning your attention to back outside of the ambulance, taking you back there for a moment, you indicated in your testimony that when you arrived, you observed two females in the area where Mr. O'Keefe was; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Can you describe anything as far as what they looked like or anything about those two females that you saw?
MR. KELLY: I just remember they were white, looked to be between 35 and 45 years old, I would say, and average build and height.
MR. LALLY: What, if any, sort of distinguishing characteristics did you observe between one or the other?
MR. KELLY: I remember one had some red stuff around her mouth. I was thinking it could be blood.
MR. LALLY: And that individual that you observed with red stuff that you thought could be blood around her mouth, what, if any, observations did you make of her as far as her demeanor or anything like that?
MR. KELLY: She was just acting kind of erratic and kind of running around, screaming different things.
MR. LALLY: And, as far as the different things that she was screaming, what, if anything, do you recall specifically hearing her screaming when she was running around?
MR. KELLY: It was just something like he's dead, he's fucking dead.
MR. LALLY: Is that something she said once or more than once or something else?
MR. KELLY: At least twice.
MR. LALLY: And, as far as that sort of phraseology, was that consistent throughout?
MR. KELLY: I would say so, yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, when you entered the ambulance, does the patient care continue, obviously, with Mr. O'Keefe?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And, if you recall, who was sort of involved in that patient care in the back of the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: Me, Nuttall, Flematti, Woodbury, Walsh. And McLaughlin came in a little bit later. I'm not sure if she did any patient care or not.
MR. LALLY: So the majority of the people from your department that responded to the scene at one point or another were involved in patient care with regard to Mr. O'Keefe?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Okay. Now, you drove the ambulance to Fairview; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And so for the transport from Fairview, what hospital did you go to?
MR. KELLY: Good Samaritan.
MR. LALLY: So for the transport from Fairview to Good Samaritan, who drove the ambulance then?
MR. KELLY: McLaughlin.
MR. LALLY: And so Firefighter McLaughlin is driving. Where are you located within the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: I was in the back with Nuttall and Flematti.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall sort of specifically what, if anything, you were doing with regard to patient care during the transport phase?
MR. KELLY: So I was just helping them -- so during the transport phase, we -- I was doing compressions before, but we had switched him over to an automatic compression device. So I was just involved in helping to ventilate and suction.
MR. LALLY: And was there any -- who, if anyone else, in the back of the ambulance was also sort of working on the airway portion if you recall?
MR. KELLY: I believe Nuttall, and I forget who else.
MR. LALLY: Now, during the course of transport from the scene when you arrived to Good Samaritan, what, if any, change did you note in reference to Mr. O'Keefe as far as heart activity, respiratory, anything of the like?
MR. KELLY: No changes.
MR. LALLY: Ms. Gilman, if I could ask for Exhibit No. 9, please.
BY MR. LALLY:
MR. LALLY: Firefighter Kelly, just directing your attention to the screen, what's been marked as Exhibit No. 9, do you recognize that?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And what do you recognize that to be?
MR. KELLY: The location of the scene.
MR. LALLY: So the house that you responded to on January 29th; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And, Ms. Gilman, if I could also have Exhibit No. 18.
BY MR. LALLY:
MR. LALLY: And, again, sir, just directing your attention to the screen, do you recognize the photograph that's up on the screen?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. LALLY: What is depicted in that photograph?
MR. KELLY: The location of the scene again.
MR. LALLY: Sort of a different view of the same home; is that correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. LALLY: May I approach the witness, Your Honor?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
BY MR. LALLY:
MR. LALLY: So, sir, I'm just going to hand you this. It's a laser pointer. Basically, there is a button there. Just press on that and point it at the screen. Firefighter Kelly, using that laser pointer that you now have before you, if you could, please direct the jury's attention on the screen to whereabouts you located Mr. O'Keefe in that supine position when you first arrived.
MR. KELLY: It was about this area right here
(indicating).
MR. LALLY: Thank you, sir.
MR. LALLY: I have nothing further for this witness.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right. Cross-examination?
MR. YANNETTI: Yes. May we approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay. Jurors, remember, you can stand up and stretch anytime you want to.
(Whereupon, there was a sidebar conference as follows:)
MR. YANNETTI: Your Honor, I just wanted to flag for the Court and to minimize the interruptions here, toward the end of my cross- examination, which I don't think will be lengthy, anyway, but I intend to refer to a video which I'm not sure is in evidence. It is the widescreen version of the Saraf video which has been premarked, and I'd like to offer it into evidence, given that I believe the foundation was already laid through Officer Saraf.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. YANNETTI: And then have the witness refer to it. I'm playing a 15-second portion of that video and that's it.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay. Any objection?
MR. LALLY: No.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. YANNETTI: Thank you.
(Whereupon, the sidebar conference concluded.)
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. YANNETTI:
MR. YANNETTI: Good morning, sir.
MR. KELLY: Good morning.
MR. YANNETTI: Mr. Kelly, you and I have never met before, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: We've never had a conversation?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: In or out of court?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, with regard to the clothing that John O'Keefe was wearing when you came upon him, I believe you remembered that he had on a pair of jeans?
MR. KELLY: To the best of my recollection, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you remembered that he had a hoodie sweatshirt?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And what also stuck out in your mind is that he only had one shoe on, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: From your memory, you're not sure if it was the left or the right shoe, but it was one of those, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you did not see another shoe or the matching shoe in the area anywhere around where he was lying, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And, to your memory, you never saw that other shoe, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, with regard to the removal of the clothing, I believe you testified before this jury on direct examination that trauma shears would have been used. Is that accurate?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And what do those look like? How big are they and if you could describe them?
MR. KELLY: They are about this big. So I would say six inches, and they have usually like a plastic or metal handle and then just kind of two curved blades that are used to cut.
MR. YANNETTI: And are they essentially a large pair of scissors?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And are they sharp in terms of the blades?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And they need to be somewhat, you know, heavy duty because you don't know what type of clothing you're going to have to cut through, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Where was it that the trauma shears were used in order to start to remove John O'Keefe's clothing?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you recall if it was before he was put into the ambulance, during the ambulance ride or after he was at the hospital?
MR. KELLY: I believe it would -- I don't recall, but I believe it would be in the ambulance.
MR. YANNETTI: I'm sorry. There is a little bit of noise. Could you repeat that?
MR. KELLY: Sure. I don't recall, but I believe it would be in the ambulance.
MR. YANNETTI: In the ambulance. And you wouldn't have waited until you got to the hospital because there was a reason why you were taking the clothes off, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And what was that reason?
MR. KELLY: To look for any other injuries that the patient might have.
MR. YANNETTI: And that was a priority as you were treating him, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You don't think that you cut off his clothes before you put him in the ambulance, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you don't think that -- and, when I say "you," I mean your team. You don't think your team cut off the clothes after he was out of the ambulance, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: So it was sometime during the ride?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you recall who it was that actually used the trauma shears along that ride?
MR. KELLY: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you recall at what point during the ride? Would it have been sort of the beginning of the ride or would it have been toward the end?
MR. KELLY: Toward the beginning.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, with regard to the clothing that was cut, do you recall if it was the sweatshirt, the jeans or both?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you think or is your memory that the hoodie sweatshirt was left on him without being cut?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Where did that clothing go after it was cut by the trauma shears during that ride?
MR. KELLY: Some of it would stay right on the stretcher, but I don't recall on all of it.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. And some of it could have been on the floor of the ambulance, as well?
MR. KELLY: Potentially.
MR. YANNETTI: And then, once the ambulance arrives at the hospital, what is the protocol regarding the clothing that had been cut?
MR. KELLY: It gets transferred over to the R.N. in charge of the patient and usually stays in their room. Usually they'll put it in some sort of bag.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. And is the clothing put in the bag -- does somebody meet you out at the ambulance in order to collect the clothing, or do you bring the clothing into the hospital in order to transfer it to an R.N.?
MR. KELLY: We bring it in.
MR. YANNETTI: And do you recall who it was that brought in that clothing?
MR. KELLY: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Who was with you at that time going into the hospital from the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: Nuttall and Flematti.
MR. YANNETTI: So it had to be one of the three of you that delivered that clothing to an R.N., correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you know if all of the clothing was delivered to an R.N. or if some stayed in the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: And, once you give the clothing to the R.N., do you see where she takes it?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Did you go into the treatment room, wherever John O'Keefe was brought once he was at the hospital?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you had previously testified that you believed the clothing would have been brought in with him, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you have a memory of seeing that clothing within that treatment room at the hospital?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you recall seeing the clothing on the floor?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, let's get back to when you first arrived on scene. And, actually, but before I get to that, I did want to ask you a couple of questions about where you were at in terms of your career on January 28th, 29th. You were a fairly new firefighter?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you were conscious -- you had been trained not long before January 29th, right? It was within several months?
MR. KELLY: Two months. Yeah.
MR. YANNETTI: Within two months. Okay. And your priority as a new firefighter was to follow your training, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: It was fresh in your mind?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You wanted to do things the right way, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Particularly at the beginning of your career. You don't want to develop any bad habits, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you were following protocol once you got to the scene as best you could, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: I believe you testified on direct examination that when you got -- when the ambulance got to 34 Fairview, as soon as it was parked, you and Anthony Flematti went straight to the body, correct?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall saying that. I wasn't sure who went straight to the body. I said some of us got some supplies.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. I thought your testimony -- correct me if I'm wrong. But I thought your testimony was that you may have gotten some supplies but then you and Flematti went straight to the body?
MR. KELLY: Yes. So we did, me and Nuttall --
MR. YANNETTI: Got supplies?
MR. KELLY: Me and Nuttall went to the body, but we didn't go straight there. We got supplies first and then went to the body, or I got supplies first and then went to the body.
MR. YANNETTI: How long did it take you to get supplies?
MR. KELLY: Probably within a minute, I would say.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. And where was Flematti when you were getting the supplies?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Once you got to the body, who assisted you with regard to treating John O'Keefe?
MR. KELLY: I believe it would be the people who were on the scene with me.
MR. YANNETTI: Who would that have been?
MR. KELLY: Flematti, Nuttall, Walsh, McLaughlin, Woodbury and Robery.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. So is it your testimony that your memory is that five, six, however many people were there with you, all were hovered over John O'Keefe, doing treatment on him?
MR. KELLY: Not treatment but getting supplies, getting a stretcher. We are all working together, but we weren't all involved in the treatment.
MR. YANNETTI: Sure. And the treatment was essentially CPR, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Chest compressions?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And dealing with his airway, as well?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Which of your coworkers and/or you were directly involved with the CPR, the chest compressions and the airway issues?
MR. KELLY: I recall that I was doing compressions and helping suction and ventilate in the ambulance, but I do not recall who else was partaking in that.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. So let's talk about when John O'Keefe was put on the scoop stretcher and then ultimately taken to the ambulance. Who was with you when that was occurring?
MR. KELLY: So it would have been me, Nuttall, Flematti and Robery, I believe, were trying to get him on the scoop. And then I believe the engine guys were trying to get the stretcher.
MR. YANNETTI: Who were the engine guys?
MR. KELLY: That would be Walsh. It must have been Walsh, Woodbury and McLaughlin. I don't recall who exactly was --
MR. YANNETTI: All right. So your memory is that yourself, Nuttall and Flematti were loading John O'Keefe onto the scoop?
MR. KELLY: I believe so, yeah.
MR. YANNETTI: And then from the scoop he's put ona stretcher?
MR. KELLY: Yeah.
MR. YANNETTI: And then who would it have been that wheeled the stretcher to the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Did you?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: So you have no memory of who would have taken John O'Keefe on that stretcher into the back of the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall who actually did it, but it would just be whoever's in the best location at the time to move the stretcher.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. Do you have a memory of John O'Keefe going into the back of the ambulance?
MR. KELLY: Not a clear memory, no.
MR. YANNETTI: Who went into the ambulance with him?
MR. KELLY: Me, Nuttall, Flematti, Walsh, Woodbury.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. And, by the way, once he's on the scoop and then put on the stretcher, the priority is to get him into that ambulance, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And part of the reason for that is he was cold, correct?
MR. KELLY: Yes, sir.
MR. YANNETTI: And your priority was you wanted to warm him up, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And the best place to do that would have been the inside of that ambulance, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: So it wasn't that he was put on the stretcher and then there was some detour in terms of where he was taken. You or whoever took him made a beeline for the back of that ambulance in order to get him warm, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And, once he's in the ambulance, the priority at that point would be to close the doors of the ambulance, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Because if you leave the doors open, there is a blizzard outside, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained. Go ahead. If you could move forward, please.
BY MR. YANNETTI:
MR. YANNETTI: And so the doors were closed to the ambulance, correct?
MR. KELLY: At some point, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And inside the doors of that ambulance, as you testified, was at least, and not naming everybody, but at least you and Nuttall and Flematti, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And, once those doors were closed to the ambulance, none of you left the ambulance, correct?
MR. KELLY: None of us, meaning --
MR. YANNETTI: I'm talking specifically about you and Nuttall and Flematti.
MR. KELLY: I don't believe so.
MR. YANNETTI: No. You would have remained in the ambulance all the way to the hospital. That's the point in which the doors would be open, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. Now, I'd like to ask you some questions about the scene that you came upon in terms of people who were there when you arrived, sir. You had previously testified that you saw -- I believe you testified that you saw -- two women anda law enforcement officer already on scene, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: One of those women appeared to have blood around her mouth, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: It was something red, but you assumed that it was blood, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And that led you to also believe that she had rendered or tried to render CPR, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Is that what you believe?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
BY MR. YANNETTI:
MR. YANNETTI: And, while you were on scene, it was the woman who had the blood around her mouth who appeared to be most upset, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: She was really upset, correct?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Would you go so far as to say she was distraught?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Hysterical?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Frantic?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you heard her say, he's dead. He's fucking dead. Something like that, correct?
MR. KELLY: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And she didn't say it in the tone of voice that I just said it, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: She was screaming when she said that, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: It was very easy for you to discern that her words were, he's dead, he's fucking dead, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And she repeated it more than once, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And it's fair to say that at no point in time did you ever hear her say, I hit him, I hit him, I hit him, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you would agree with me, sir, that you have been extremely consistent in terms of your memory of what she said, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You've been asked these questions not for the first time by Mr. Lally or me in court today. There have been other occasions where people have asked you what did the woman with the blood on her mouth say when she was on scene, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You were asked that by Trooper Proctor on February 9th of 2022, correct?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: It's probably unfair of me to say the date, but you do recall speaking to a state police not long after these incidents, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And, to that state trooper, you told him that what she said was, he's dead, he's fucking dead, correct?
MR. KELLY: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: You don't recall saying anything differently than that, do you?
MR. KELLY: I remember saying a lot differently, but I might have also said that. I just don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Let me rephrase that. You don't recall changing her words at all. You recall you've always said, he's dead, he's fucking dead, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: That was not only to the state police on February 9th but then in April of 2022, you were ina grand jury setting, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: There was no defense attorney there on that day, correct?
MR. KELLY: I don't believe so.
MR. YANNETTI: You don't remember seeing me there?
MR. KELLY: No. I didn't see you there.
MR. YANNETTI: Mr. Lally was asking you the questions, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And, there, you also said that what the woman with the blood on her mouth said was, he's dead, he's fucking dead, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you've testified to that today?
MR. KELLY: Yes, sir.
MR. YANNETTI: You've never changed that story, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And that is because the truth does not change, correct?
MR. KELLY: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: At this point, I'd like to play a 15-second portion of a video which I would offer as the next exhibit, Your Honor.
JUDGE CANNONE: We'll watch it, and then --
MR. YANNETTI: Thank you very much.
JUDGE CANNONE: No narration, right?
MR. YANNETTI: Nothing.
BY MR. YANNETTI:
MR. YANNETTI: Before you start, I'm not as interested in the video, sir. I'm interested in the audio. So if you could listen as best you can.
MR. KELLY: Yes.
(Whereupon, the video is played.)
BY MR. YANNETTI:
MR. YANNETTI: Would you agree with me, sir, that we heard what you heard that night, which is, he's dead, he's fucking dead?
MR. KELLY: It was kind of hard for me to hear. I heard about does he do drugs. I couldn't really hear the background.
MR. YANNETTI: If I may have a moment, Your Honor?
JUDGE CANNONE: You may.
MR. YANNETTI: May we approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
(Whereupon, there was a sidebar conference as follows:)
MR. YANNETTI: I don't want to overstep my bounds, but I'd like to play the video one more time just for the purpose of directing him more toward the beginning of the video, which it is before the statements that he said. And my argument --
JUDGE CANNONE: For what purpose?
MR. YANNETTI: Just to see if he can -- I heard it. I think other people heard it.
JUDGE CANNONE: But doesn't what matter is whether the jury hears it?
MR. YANNETTI: Correct.
JUDGE CANNONE: So that's the law, correct, Mr. Yannetti?
MR. YANNETTI: Oh, for sure. For sure. But the testimony right now, if I can get the witness to acknowledge that, I think that will assist the jury. And I don't think there is any -- I'm not looking to unnecessarily delay the trial. I'm looking for about 10 seconds.
JUDGE CANNONE: No. Play it again and just ask him if he heard that.
MR. YANNETTI: Thank you. Thank you.
JUDGE CANNONE: Don't ask him whether he heard. Just say, what did you hear.
MR. YANNETTI: Good. Thank you.
(Whereupon, the sidebar conference concluded.)
BY MR. YANNETTI:
MR. YANNETTI: Mr. Kelly, I got permission to play it one more time.
MR. KELLY: I'll try my best.
MR. YANNETTI: So again -- and, by the way, before it's queued up, I would direct your attention more toward the beginning of that 15 seconds. There are things that happened, I think, that you heard at the end. But you tell us if you can hear or what you can hear.
(Whereupon, the video is played.)
MR. YANNETTI: That's enough.
BY MR. YANNETTI:
MR. YANNETTI: What did you hear?
MR. KELLY: I heard someone say "fucking dead."
MR. YANNETTI: Thank you, sir.
JUDGE CANNONE: Any redirect?
MR. LALLY: Just briefly, Your Honor.