Commonwealth v. Read — Trial ArchiveJulie Albert - Cross (Part 2)
600 linesCOURT CLERK: ...the case... Commonwealth versus Karen Read. Counsel, please identify off the record.
MR. LALLY: Adam Lally for the Commonwealth. Good morning.
JUDGE CANNONE: Good morning.
MS. MCLAUGHLIN: McLaughlin for the Commonwealth. Good morning.
JUDGE CANNONE: Good morning, Ms. McLaughlin.
MR. JACKSON: Alan Jackson for the defense. Good morning.
JUDGE CANNONE: Good morning, Mr. Jackson.
MS. LITTLE: Good morning, your Honor. Elizabeth Little, also on behalf of Ms. Read.
JUDGE CANNONE: Good morning, Miss Little.
MS. LITTLE: Good morning, your Honor.
MR. YANNETTI: David Yannetti for Karen Read. Good morning, Mr. Yannetti.
JUDGE CANNONE: Good morning, Ms. Read. All right, did counsel want to see me at sidebar? I had asked —
PARENTHETICAL: [Sidebar — inaudible]
COURT CLERK: Hear ye, hear ye, hear ye. All parties having anything to do before The Honorable First Justice Beverly Cannone, now sitting in the Dedham Superior Court within and for the County of Norfolk, draw near, give your attendance, you shall be heard. God save the Commonwealth and this good court. Thank you.
JUDGE CANNONE: May be seated. Good morning. Good morning, all right. Good morning again, counsel. Good morning again, Ms. Read. Good morning, jurors. Happy Friday. I appreciate you all being here, ready, willing, and able to start. We got an awfully lot done in about five or seven minutes over here in sidebar. We made you wait, but in the long run it'll speed things up and make things go more smoothly. So we appreciate your patience. Those same three questions: have you all been able to follow the instruction to refrain from discussing this case with anyone since you left yesterday? Everyone said yes or nodded affirmatively. Were you all able to follow the instruction and refrain from doing any independent research or investigation into this case? Everyone said yes or nodded affirmatively.
JUDGE CANNONE: Did anyone happen to see, hear, or read anything about this case since we left yesterday? No. One thing I did want to say to you folks is, if you can't hear a witness or a lawyer, or you can't see something, I don't know that unless you raise your hand. So if you raise your hand, the court officers don't have the power to say to the witness, please answer that again and speak louder — but I do. So if you raise your hand, a court officer will come over and let me know, and we can make sure that happens. All right. I remind counsel to keep their voices up, and you've been doing a great job of moving out of the way of the jurors toward the end there, so please continue to do so. All right. Is Ms. Albert here?
COURT CLERK: ...the truth, the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
MS. ALBERT: I do.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay. I'm just going to remind you, keep your voice up, please, Ms. Albert.
MS. ALBERT: Okay.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right.
MR. YANNETTI: Thank you. Good morning, Ms. Albert.
MS. ALBERT: Good morning.
MR. YANNETTI: Ma'am, you will recall yesterday I broached the topic with you of how often you and Courtney Proctor speak to each other over the phone. Do you recall that line of questioning?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And when I asked you to describe the frequency of those phone calls, I didn't put any words in your mouth, did I? I didn't suggest how frequently they were — you came up with the word. I don't — let me put it this way. When I asked you how often you talked to Courtney Proctor, you could have chosen any word in the English language to answer that question, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: What was the word that you chose?
MS. ALBERT: Not often. I — I don't remember.
MR. YANNETTI: Rarely?
MS. ALBERT: Rarely.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes, that was your word, correct?
MS. ALBERT: It could have been. I don't really recall. I was — I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: You don't recall telling this jury yesterday that when I asked you about how often you spoke to Courtney Proctor by phone, you said "well, rarely"?
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember.
MR. YANNETTI: What is your definition of rarely?
MS. ALBERT: Not daily.
MR. YANNETTI: Not daily? Not — once in a blue moon?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Rarely doesn't mean to you 67 phone conversations within a 7-month period, does it?
MS. ALBERT: A 67 — in how many — eight months?
MR. YANNETTI: In about seven months. 67 times.
MS. ALBERT: It's — it's not a lot. I — I wouldn't think it's a lot in seven months.
MR. YANNETTI: Three times in one day — is that rarely?
MS. ALBERT: No, but I'm not — that wasn't every day.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. Well, when you left the stand yesterday, did you log into your account or check any old bills to confirm those 67 calls?
MS. ALBERT: No, I did not.
MR. YANNETTI: Did you speak to Mr. Lally about those 67 calls after we broke yesterday and before you took the stand today?
MS. ALBERT: I don't believe so. No.
MR. YANNETTI: Did you call Courtney Proctor — in one of those rare occasions — yesterday?
MS. ALBERT: No, I did not.
MR. YANNETTI: This morning?
MS. ALBERT: No, I did not.
MR. YANNETTI: Were you — were you curious as to whether or not you had actually called her those 67 times?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. In any case, regarding all of those 67 phone calls from February 1st until September 6th, do you maintain that during none of those calls, or any portion of those calls, did you and Courtney Proctor discuss the investigation into the death of John O'Keefe?
MS. ALBERT: I do not remember.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you deny discussing that investigation?
MS. ALBERT: I don't deny, but I do not remember.
MR. YANNETTI: All right, well you admitted yesterday, after having seen the records, that you spoke with Michael Proctor's sister for 12 minutes on February 1st of 2022. Did you recall that?
MS. ALBERT: I don't recall the conversation, no. I don't. It was a long time ago. I'm sorry —
MR. YANNETTI: I don't mean to interrupt you. Finish your —
MS. ALBERT: I'm sorry. It was a long time ago. I just don't remember.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. But my question is — after seeing the records, you saw the phone call for over 12 minutes, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you also remember that that was the very day that the police arrested Karen Read for this case, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: The arrest of Karen Read on February 1st was pretty big news in Massachusetts, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. YANNETTI: You had seen that arrest all over the news, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: So certainly, given the day, and the fact that it was February 1st and my client was arrested that day, and you're talking to the lead investigator's sister, the subject of Karen Read's arrest had to have come up, right?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained. Ask it differently.
MR. YANNETTI: You certainly mentioned my client's arrest with Courtney Proctor on the very day that she was arrested, and you were talking to Courtney, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, when we broke for the day yesterday, I had also asked you about the three phone calls that you had with Michael Proctor's sister on the morning of February 2nd, when my client was arraigned, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you recall that her arraignment was televised publicly, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained. Ask it differently.
MR. YANNETTI: You saw her on the news being arraigned, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And — one of those phone calls after — well, strike that. With regard to the three phone calls before the arraignment, you knew at that time that my client had been arrested the day before, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you knew she would be arraigned in court that morning, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Certainly, when you were talking to Michael Proctor's sister on February 2nd, before her 9:00 arraignment, you were discussing the 9:00 arraignment, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Can you repeat the end of that, please?
MR. YANNETTI: On February 2nd, the day that my client was scheduled to be arraigned in Stoughton District Court, we're talking about the three phone calls that you made to Michael Proctor's sister before that arraignment that very day, and my question is — certainly you were discussing the fact that she was about to be arraigned, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained. Ask it differently.
MR. YANNETTI: Ms. Albert, did the subject of Karen Read's arraignment come up in any of those three calls on February 2nd, the day she was going to be arraigned, before her arraignment?
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember exactly.
MR. YANNETTI: What about the 27-minute phone call that you had with Courtney Proctor at 10:58 a.m. that same day, after my client was arraigned in [unintelligible]? Did you discuss the arraignment that had just happened?
MS. ALBERT: I do not remember.
MR. YANNETTI: You had already testified that by 2022 you were no longer babysitting for Courtney Proctor's kids, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I wasn't babysitting regularly like I was before.
MR. YANNETTI: So is it your testimony that you happened to be talking about babysitting on February 2nd for 27 minutes, the same day that my client was arraigned in Stoughton District Court?
MS. ALBERT: I — I don't remember what I was talking about. It could have been about the kids. It could have been about — it could have been about anything. I don't remember.
MR. YANNETTI: Sure, and certainly it could have been about the publicly televised arraignment that had just occurred, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'll allow this, and then let's move away from this, okay? Can you answer that?
MS. ALBERT: Yes, it could have been.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes. Did you tell Courtney Proctor during any of these 67 phone calls that you — Were you a witness in her brother's case?
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. Miss Albert, you were at the Waterfall on the night of January 28th, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you also went to 34 Fairview Road on the morning of January 29th?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Yet as of the date of these phone calls that we've discussed so far — the February 1st and the February 2nd multiple phone calls — Trooper Proctor still had not interviewed you, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You were finally interviewed by Trooper Proctor on February 10th, about 13 days after John O'Keefe was found dead on Brian Albert's, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you told Courtney Proctor that you were nervous to speak to her brother, Trooper Proctor, about this case. Do you remember that?
MS. ALBERT: I do not remember those exact words, no.
MR. YANNETTI: All right, but you were nervous to speak to him, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Of course I was nervous in general for a police interview. I mean, I don't know someone who wouldn't be.
MR. YANNETTI: Were you worried that one of Trooper Proctor's colleagues might ask to speak to your son Colin about what had happened on the 28th and the 29th? judge cannone: i'll overrule.
MS. ALBERT: Was I nervous they would ask my son? Yeah.
MR. YANNETTI: Were you nervous that one of the investigators in this case might approach your son to ask him about his whereabouts?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. In any case, you were interviewed at 5:30 p.m. on February 10th, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Where did that interview take place?
MS. ALBERT: At my home in Canton.
MR. YANNETTI: Who was present for that interview?
MS. ALBERT: Me, my husband, Trooper Proctor, and Trooper Bukhenik.
MR. YANNETTI: Michael Proctor agreed to interview you and your husband together, correct? Just you and your husband were interviewed together, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct, correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Did either of these troopers, including Michael Proctor, suggest that maybe the two of you should be separately interviewed?
MS. ALBERT: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Within your home?
MS. ALBERT: In my family room.
MR. YANNETTI: Were you sitting on couches?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Comfortable?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: You were not in a police interrogation room, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No, I was not.
MR. YANNETTI: And it wasn't particularly lengthy, correct?
MS. ALBERT: What do you define as "lengthy"? And I don't remember how long it was exactly.
MR. YANNETTI: It didn't go into the evening, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And then Michael Proctor and the other trooper left, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Then at 6:17 p.m. that same night, shortly after you had been interviewed, you called Michael Proctor's personal cell phone number, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember.
PARENTHETICAL: [pause]
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't bring your cheaters today? Oh, you did — good. May I approach?
PARENTHETICAL: [pause]
MR. YANNETTI: Did that refresh your memory about those two phone calls on February 10th?
MR. YANNETTI: Let me have a moment.
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: This is the same document. I'm going to hand you one document. There's an orange sticky on it that you can ignore, but right above the orange sticky there's a date of February 10th — that's what I'm directing your attention to. You can look at those two phone calls, ma'am, and look up at me when you're done.
MS. ALBERT: I mean, I just read them, but I don't remember.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. You called Trooper Proctor at 6:17 p.m. and it appears to be a 5-second phone call. Did you see that? Do you recall that Trooper Proctor called you back that same day at 6:21 p.m. and that you spoke for about 4 minutes? Do you deny speaking to Trooper Proctor for four minutes when he called you from his personal cell phone on February 10th of 2022, after you had been interviewed?
MS. ALBERT: No, I don't deny it, but I don't remember it.
MR. YANNETTI: When did you get his personal cell phone number?
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember. Years ago, I'm sure.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes, because you've known that family for a long time?
MS. ALBERT: Yes, I have.
MR. YANNETTI: And as you testify here today, you can't remember what that phone call would have been about, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No, I do not remember.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. I'd like to contrast your relationship with Karen Read versus your relationships with Jennifer McCabe and Courtney Proctor. You would agree with me — and I think you testified yesterday — that Jennifer McCabe is one of your best friends, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you call her Jen, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And Courtney Proctor is also one of your best friends, correct?
MS. ALBERT: She's not one of my best friends, no.
MR. YANNETTI: She's a good friend?
MS. ALBERT: She's not one of my best friends, no. She's my sister's best friend.
MR. YANNETTI: Gotcha. Okay, so your sister —
MS. ALBERT: My sister Jillian.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes. Jillian is best friends with Courtney Proctor, and you're close friends with her but not best friends, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: But you really only knew Karen Read as John O'Keefe's girlfriend, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: She was just an acquaintance of yours?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: There are no photos of you in a hot tub together — you and Karen Read — right?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: There are no photos of you with your arms around each other at the beach, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: You've never been to a baby shower with Karen Read, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't have any contact with Karen Read while you were growing up, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Karen Read was definitely not from Canton, correct?
JUDGE CANNONE: I'll allow this, and then you can move on.
MS. ALBERT: No, she was not.
MR. YANNETTI: One more question — she was an outsider, correct, to Canton? She didn't live in Canton. But after she started dating John, you would see her driving in and out of the street, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: You'd see her taking groceries in, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Because you were neighbors with John?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And it was the fact that you'd see her around — you know, taking groceries in and out of the house and being outside with the kids — that led you to believe that she was not only connected to John but also to his house on Meadows Ave, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you would see her interacting with the kids outside, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: She would be participating in family-type activities with the kids outside?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you'd see her enough that you assumed that she was living there, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And I believe you stated that you had known her or seen her for maybe about a year and a half or so — is that a good estimate?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And in all the time that you saw her in the neighborhood or had any contact with her and John, you never saw the two of them fight or argue, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: You never heard them fight or argue, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: And you had been out with them in a group setting a handful of times, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Just a couple of times.
MR. YANNETTI: And during those times they always appeared to get along, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you knew of no problems in their relationship, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: And you were particularly impressed with the time Karen spent with John's adopted children?
MS. ALBERT: Can you repeat that once more, please?
MR. YANNETTI: You were impressed with the amount of time that Karen spent with John's children?
MS. ALBERT: I didn't know the exact amount of time, but she was there a lot, yes. I would assume that she spent a lot of time with them, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, on Friday, January 28th, you had plans with your sister-in-law Nicole, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: You are close with Nicole?
MS. ALBERT: Yes, I am.
MR. YANNETTI: You picked her up at her home in your car?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: You drove her to the Waterfall, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And the two of you went for dinner there?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Your husband Chris came later?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Brian Higgins came later?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you knew Brian Higgins, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
JUDGE CANNONE: I want to stop you for one second. All right.
MR. YANNETTI: Thank you. Mr. — no, thank you. I believe you testified you knew Brian Higgins at that time, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And how did you know him?
MS. ALBERT: He is a friend of my brother-in-law.
MR. YANNETTI: And your brother-in-law would be Brian Albert, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And by the way, when I just asked you that question about how you knew Brian Higgins and what his relationship was to Brian Albert, you didn't hesitate to say that they were friends, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: It was very clear that they were friends, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: In fact, the two of them arrived at the bar together, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And it didn't surprise you to see the two of them together, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Karen and John came sometime after that?
MS. ALBERT: I believe shortly after that, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And they walked over to your table?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And then John kind of came up from behind you and, in a joking way, dug his finger into your shoulder, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And essentially said, "you know, what's up"? He made a joke — the joke being, given the fact that you and your husband moved from the neighborhood, they decided to hold a block party?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And John was the same jokester he always was, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct. Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you had some contact with Karen while you were at the bar, before you had to leave because of the migraine, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And she was just very bubbly that night, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: That's just her personality, as far as you could see, correct?
MS. ALBERT: As far as I knew, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you left the Waterfall at around 11:00 — your best memory, a little after 11?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And it was a particularly bad migraine that night?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And the loud music didn't help you out at all?
MS. ALBERT: Not at all.
MR. YANNETTI: And you drove home?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, when you got home, your son Colin was not there, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: He was not out with you at the Waterfall, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: He was out that night, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you knew that he stops by your sister-in-law Nicole's house quite a bit, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: He's very close to Nicole and Brian's kids, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: He's also very close to his aunt and uncle, Brian Albert and Nicole Albert, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: So you would have gotten home maybe shortly after 11:10 p.m.?
MS. ALBERT: Approximately around 11.
MR. YANNETTI: Yep. Around that. And that was when you entered an empty house, correct?
MS. ALBERT: My son Dylan was home.
MR. YANNETTI: Oh, Dylan was home?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: But Colin was not?
MS. ALBERT: He was not.
MR. YANNETTI: And Colin did not come home at 11:30, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: He did not come home at 11:45, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And when the clock turned midnight he still wasn't home, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, at some point, your husband Chris came home?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: You testified on direct examination that Chris came home at 12:10 a.m. on January 29th?
MS. ALBERT: That's what time I believe he did.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes. Okay. That 12:10 a.m. — did you discuss that precise time with anybody prior to taking the stand yesterday?
PARENTHETICAL: [unclear]
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Was that coordinated with anybody such that your husband and you gave the same time at 12:10 a.m.?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: With the Court's permission, I'd like to play the Waterfall lobby video — I think it's exhibit 53 — just that portion.
JUDGE CANNONE: Just have a moment.
MR. YANNETTI: I'm going to allow my colleague some time to find this and I'll move on with my questioning in the meantime. We can have the lights on now. I believe you've testified that the Waterfall is very close to D&E Pizza, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: But your house on Maple Street is about a half mile away from the Waterfall — would you agree with that?
MS. ALBERT: About that, yes. Maybe a little less, but about that.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. Would you agree it's a, you know, seven or eight minute walk home from the Waterfall if you're walking — I realize you were driving — but if somebody were walking, it would be about seven or eight minutes? Maybe a minute or two—
MS. ALBERT: — less.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay, so six — you would say six or seven minutes would be a better estimate to cover that half mile?
MS. ALBERT: Depends on how fast you walk.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes. And it was snowing that night, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: The ground was a little bit slippery?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: If I could have the lights dimmed again — this is the exhibit I'd like to show you, ma'am. And if you can pause for one second. Do you recognize what's depicted in that video? Does that appear to be the Waterfall?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. And you see the— Do you see the time 12:13 a.m.?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. If you could run that, Mr. Woll — close it there. I am going to direct your — do you see where it says "CH3"?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you see the time stamp up at the top, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Between those two markers on the video, you're going to see somebody walking by. I'd ask you to pay attention for the next, you know, six seconds or so. Stop. Do you recognize that person?
MS. ALBERT: Yes. I believe it's my husband.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay, you can run that. Stop. Would you agree with me that your husband left the Waterfall at about 12:13 and 46 seconds?
MS. ALBERT: Well, yes. I mean, that's what it says on the screen.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay, so it was closer to— — 12:14 than to 12:10. Would you agree with that?
MS. ALBERT: 12:14, you mean?
MR. YANNETTI: You know what, you're right — 12:14, not 12:10. Yes, that's what I'm seeing. Thank you. So if he's leaving at around 12:14, and by your testimony it would have taken him — he was walking home, you knew that, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: He didn't have a car?
MS. ALBERT: He did not.
MR. YANNETTI: And if it took him six or seven minutes to get home — and, by the way, let me strike that question. You had said it would take six or seven minutes — did you factor in the fact of the weather that night for your estimate about a six or seven minute walk?
JUDGE CANNONE: Jackson, can you answer that question?
MS. ALBERT: That's what I said. Yes. I didn't factor in the weather. I — I don't — I don't know.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. So your testimony is you don't know if it would have taken him a little bit longer. Or anybody — everyone walks at a different pace, right? But whatever pace they walk at — given what you saw of the weather that night — is it your testimony that maybe it would have taken a little bit longer than the estimate?
MS. ALBERT: It could have.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. But in any case, let's leave it at six or seven minutes. That puts your husband coming home at around 12:20 or 12:21, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. And that 12:10 estimate that you had — — you made that estimate before having the benefit of the video, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, where were you in the house when your husband came home?
MS. ALBERT: In my room — upstairs, in my bedroom.
MR. YANNETTI: And you share a bedroom with your husband?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. And when he came — when was the first time that you saw him within the house?
MS. ALBERT: He came up to the bedroom.
MR. YANNETTI: You were in the bedroom and you saw him appear in the bedroom, correct? Did you hear the door open way down on the first floor?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. And it would have taken him maybe about a minute to get upstairs?
MS. ALBERT: It wasn't very long.
MR. YANNETTI: It wouldn't be very long, no. Okay. And when he got upstairs, you noticed that he was in wet clothing—
MS. ALBERT: — correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes. He appeared to be cold?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And he got undressed, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Did he brush his teeth before bed?
MS. ALBERT: I think he got right into bed.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay, so you didn't see him brush his teeth or wash up?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: And were you in the bed when he came into bed to go to sleep?
MS. ALBERT: I was sitting up in bed, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Were you reading or watching TV?
MS. ALBERT: I was just sitting up in bed, praying for my headache to go away.
MR. YANNETTI: Oh, okay. You still — the migraine was still really bothering you, and you were suffering at that point?
MS. ALBERT: Suffering? I had a headache.
MR. YANNETTI: Well, yeah, but a migraine headache —
MS. ALBERT: I imagine it was — it was a headache, but I took medicine and I— — was waiting for it to kick in.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes, okay. And that's sort of what you were concentrating on — it's really kind of hard to read or watch TV or concentrate on anything when you have a migraine, right?
MS. ALBERT: Okay, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, you would agree with me that your husband Chris was asleep when Colin came home, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And as a mother, you couldn't have gone to sleep until you knew your kids were home, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And Colin was the remaining child who was out — and when he came home, that gave you license to go to sleep?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, at the time that Colin came home, with Chris sleeping, it's fair to say— — this was just an ordinary weekend night, correct?
MS. ALBERT: How do you—
MR. YANNETTI: Well, in other words, you didn't know that anything tragic had occurred or was alleged to have occurred, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: So it wasn't like you were paying attention to the clock at that point and recording your memories as best you could because you knew you'd be testifying later, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Which also explains the 12:10 estimate, right? I mean, you're being asked about times that things occurred and it was just sort of an ordinary day, right. So it's difficult to pinpoint times, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. Now, directing your attention to the next morning — — you missed a phone call from your best friend Jennifer McCabe, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you believe that phone call — I think according to your memory yesterday — came in at 5:55 a.m., correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: That was the time that you gave Mr. Lally when he asked you the question on direct examination, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And you were able to recall that time nearly two years later, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: But regarding the 67 phone calls between you and Courtney Proctor that happened after that, you're not able to recall any of those, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I just don't remember them.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. In any case, January 29th— — was your nephew Brian Albert Jr.'s birthday, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: That's why you went to 34 Fairview at 8:30 in the morning, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And when you pulled into the driveway, there was nothing unusual to you, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: This was just your brother-in-law Brian and your sister-in-law Nicole's house with snow around, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: There were no police on scene?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: There was no tent protecting the front lawn, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: No crime scene tape — stapled anywhere or taped anywhere — correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Nobody appeared to be standing guard over the front yard, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't see any shard of glass?
MS. ALBERT: No, I did not.
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't see 45 pieces of tail light strewn about the lawn, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: In fact, you didn't see any pieces of tail light, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I don't recall seeing anything.
MR. YANNETTI: And you didn't suspect that 34 Fairview was a crime scene, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: There was nothing that prevented you from walking all over that front lawn, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: It was still snowing out?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Brian Albert — when you approached the house, he opened the door, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I approached the car, not the house.
MR. YANNETTI: Oh, okay. You approached — whose car was it?
MS. ALBERT: My nephew Brian's — in the driveway.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes, all right. And then Brian Albert opened the door of the house — the side door of—
MR. YANNETTI: — thank you.
MS. ALBERT: — the home.
MR. YANNETTI: Yes, all right. So, can I have exhibit 8 please, with the Court's permission?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Could we zoom in just a little bit? That's—
MS. ALBERT: — good.
PARENTHETICAL: [unclear]
MS. ALBERT: You're welcome.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. That — that I'm highlighting now is the front door to the house, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And if we move along exhibit 8 to the right, is that the side door?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And that's the door that Brian Albert appeared from?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you were able to see him from the outside of the house, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you were over to this area?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Do you recall — is it one of those two cars that's in exhibit 8 that you approached with the Dunkin' Donuts?
MS. ALBERT: I can't make out what the cars are.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. But it was either one of those two cars or a car that was parked in one of those two places?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: All right, and then did you go in that side door to go into the house?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Fair to say that family has lived there for quite a while, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: You knew that — prior to Brian Albert — and I'm sorry, oh, I'm sorry. That's really bad form to block the jury. I am so sorry.
MS. ALBERT: It's good, I didn't trip.
MR. YANNETTI: The door that is the front door — having, you know, been familiar with that house for a long time, you've gone in that front door before, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you know that when you go in the front door of that house, you come into a little foyer area, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And then almost within arm's distance to the left is the door to the basement, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Walking in the front door, arm's distance to the left?
MR. YANNETTI: Yes. In other words, you walk into the house —
MS. ALBERT: That's incorrect. To the left is the library.
MR. YANNETTI: All right, where is the door to the basement?
MS. ALBERT: You walk in the front door, you step to the right, walk a few steps towards the kitchen, and the basement door is on the left before you enter the kitchen.
MR. YANNETTI: All right, but the kitchen's off to the left, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No. When you walk in the front door, the library is on the left, there's another room on the left. Okay, so you walk in, you immediately see a staircase in front of you.
MR. YANNETTI: Yeah.
MS. ALBERT: And to the left is the library. If you go to the right — I'm sorry — if you go to the right, you can go into the part of the kitchen where the kitchen table is, or you can not go to the right, you can walk straight. And as you're walking, there's a door on the left, and that's where the basement door is.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. So I think we're getting to what I was getting at. If you walk straight ahead, there's a door to the left that goes down to the basement, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And when you were walking toward that side door, you didn't see any emergency or police vehicles outside, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No, I did not.
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't see any first responders other than Brian Albert, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: There were no lights flashing outside the house, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And inside you saw Nicole Albert?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Brian Albert?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Jennifer McCabe?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Matt McCabe?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And Brian Higgins?
MS. ALBERT: Correct, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: How long did you spend at the house that morning?
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember exactly, maybe a half hour, 45 minutes. I don't remember exactly.
MR. YANNETTI: And the seven of you were discussing what had happened, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: At some point it was decided that Jennifer McCabe should contact Michael Lank of the — of the Canton Police, correct?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'll allow it if this witness knows independently. Can you repeat that once more, please.
MR. YANNETTI: At some point it was decided among the seven of you that Jennifer McCabe should contact Michael Lank of the Canton Police Department.
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember who exactly. Jennifer decided.
MR. YANNETTI: You don't remember exactly the discussion?
MS. ALBERT: I don't remember exactly.
MR. YANNETTI: You knew Michael Lank, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And at 8:53 a.m. you sent to Jennifer McCabe Michael Lank's personal cell phone number, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And did you then see Jennifer McCabe delete that text message from you?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. YANNETTI: You were contacted by the Massachusetts State Police this year about your phone, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: They left you a voicemail on March 21st of 2024 — the state police?
MS. ALBERT: Yes, about my telephone.
MR. YANNETTI: Well, they left you a voicemail on March 21st of 2024. You've had contact with the state police this year?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And they left you a second voicemail on March 25, and then called you again on March 28?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: You told them that you were sick and you would speak to them on April 1st, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And then the state police called you on April 1st but you did not pick up. Do you recall that?
MS. ALBERT: I do not.
MR. YANNETTI: They called you again that same day and you didn't respond, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: But you did learn that they had called your husband on April 1st looking for you, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I don't recall.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. After speaking with your husband, you texted the Massachusetts State Police on April 1st, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I think around that. I don't know the exact date.
MR. YANNETTI: All right. And you finally met with the Massachusetts State Police on April 3rd of 2024, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I would assume. I don't know the exact date, but yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And during that meeting, the state police looked through your phone for contact that you would have had with Trooper Proctor, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Did they seize your phone?
MS. ALBERT: No, they did not.
MR. YANNETTI: Did they tell you that they had a search warrant for your phone?
MS. ALBERT: No, they did not.
MR. YANNETTI: Did they take it back saying that they had to give it to some experts to do an extraction?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. YANNETTI: They just looked through it after you handed it to them, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Then they gave it back?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, with regard to your contact with Karen on January 28th, it was clear to you that Karen did not appear to be under the influence, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't see her stumbling, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't see her swaying, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: She was not unbalanced?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: She was not slurring her words?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: She was not talking gibberish?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: She was engaging in normal conversation?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And she held the conversation perfectly fine?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: She appeared to be under control, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: She was affectionate with John that night?
MS. ALBERT: I didn't come in contact with them like that.
MR. YANNETTI: Well, the two of them certainly were not arguing?
MS. ALBERT: No, not that I saw.
MR. YANNETTI: You didn't see any tension between them, correct?
MS. ALBERT: No.
MR. YANNETTI: And, given your family's connection to law enforcement, you would not knowingly let someone drive a car if they were under the influence, correct? Everyone appeared to be having a good time, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And that included John and Karen from what you could see, correct?
MS. ALBERT: For the 10, 15 minutes I was there, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. Now, after you left the Waterfall, it's fair to say that you didn't know precisely where your son Colin was that night, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I knew where he was.
MR. YANNETTI: Where was he?
MS. ALBERT: He was at his friend Michael Leonetti's. He left Michael Leonetti's to stop to say happy birthday to my nephew Brian at 34 Fairview Road.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay. And you learned that from him, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: So you had learned that Colin was at 34 Fairview on January 29th of 2022, correct?
MS. ALBERT: January 28th.
MR. YANNETTI: So is it your testimony that you know that Colin left on Friday night as opposed to after midnight on January 29th?
MS. ALBERT: I don't — I don't understand what you're asking.
MR. YANNETTI: Just what just occurred is — I asked you whether you knew that your son Colin was at your sister-in-law Nicole's and your brother-in-law Brian Albert's house on January 29th, and you said — correct?
MS. ALBERT: I'm sorry, it was after — I'm sorry, it was after midnight. So that's — I got confused. I apologize.
MR. YANNETTI: Not a problem. So the answer to the question is, you learned that he was there on January 29th, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes, after midnight.
MR. YANNETTI: And you now know that that is the same house outside which John O'Keefe was found dead that morning, correct?
MS. ALBERT: Yes, I do.
MR. YANNETTI: And one last question — you were interviewed by Trooper Proctor, and it's fair to say you never told him that Colin was there that night, correct?
MS. ALBERT: I don't recall my interview.
MR. YANNETTI: I have no further questions. Thank you.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right. Mr. Lally.