Commonwealth v. Read — Trial ArchiveCurt Roberts - Direct/Cross/Redirect
343 linesJUDGE CANNONE: Your next witness, Mr. Lally?
MR. LALLY: Yes. Call — uh — call Mr. Curt Roberts to the stand.
COURT CLERK: Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
COURT CLERK: Thank you. Just speak nice and loud into that microphone. Thanks.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right. Whenever you're ready, Mr. Lally.
MR. LALLY: Thank you. Good morning, sir.
MR. ROBERTS: Good morning.
MR. LALLY: Would you please state your name and spell your last name for the jury?
MR. ROBERTS: Curt Roberts — R-O-B-E-R-T-S.
MR. LALLY: And where do you live, sir?
MR. ROBERTS: Canton, Mass.
MR. LALLY: And how long have you lived in Canton?
MR. ROBERTS: About 12 years now.
MR. LALLY: And who, if anyone, do you live with?
MR. ROBERTS: I live with my wife and two children.
MR. LALLY: And your wife — what is your wife's name?
MR. ROBERTS: Kerry.
MR. LALLY: And how long have the two of you been married?
MR. ROBERTS: We've been married 15 years.
MR. LALLY: And you mentioned you have two children, is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And how old are your kids?
MR. ROBERTS: My daughter is 14 and my son is 12.
MR. LALLY: And do you work, sir?
MR. ROBERTS: I do.
MR. LALLY: And what do you do?
MR. ROBERTS: I'm a heavy equipment operator.
MR. LALLY: About how long have you been doing that?
MR. ROBERTS: 26 years.
MR. LALLY: And your wife Kerry — does she work as well?
MR. ROBERTS: She does.
MR. LALLY: And what does she do?
MR. ROBERTS: She's an executive assistant.
MR. LALLY: And do you know about how long she's been doing that?
MR. ROBERTS: I think about 18 years.
MR. LALLY: And if I could turn your attention to the evening of January 28th, 2022 — you recall that day?
MR. ROBERTS: I do.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall anything about what you were doing — do you recall what day of the week it was?
MR. ROBERTS: I know it was a Friday night.
MR. LALLY: And earlier in the day — do you recall anything specific about what you were doing that day?
MR. ROBERTS: No, I don't. Nothing stands out.
MR. LALLY: And at some point in time in the evening — were you at home?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes, I was at home.
MR. LALLY: And while you were at home, who, if anyone, reached out?
MR. ROBERTS: Michael Camerano and John O'Keefe. And starting with Michael Camerano — how do you know him? I grew up with him — well, since sixth grade. We're both from the same town, Milton.
MR. LALLY: So the two of you grew up in Milton together — you've known him essentially since then?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: How would you describe your relationship with Mr. Camerano?
MR. ROBERTS: We're friends.
MR. LALLY: And does Mr. Camerano have any children around the age of your two children?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes — I believe a 16-year-old daughter and a 12-year-old son.
MR. LALLY: And his son and your son — did they do any sort of activities together?
MR. ROBERTS: They did — they played baseball together.
MR. LALLY: Now, you mentioned John O'Keefe as well, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And how did you know John O'Keefe?
MR. ROBERTS: When his sister and brother-in-law had passed, he had moved into the house that they lived in in my neighborhood. And my wife knew him previously and introduced me.
MR. LALLY: And the house that he moved into — with regard to where his sister and brother-in-law lived — where was that in relation to where you live?
MR. ROBERTS: In the vicinity — not far — very easily walking distance, maybe — not far.
MR. LALLY: And the house that Mr. O'Keefe moved into — who, if anyone, did he initially live there with?
MR. ROBERTS: When he moved, he moved in there with — his niece and nephew.
MR. LALLY: His niece and nephew from the couple that had passed?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And you had a niece named Kaye — That correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: A nephew named Patrick?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And with respect to his nephew Patrick, how old was he in relation to your son and Mr. Camerano's son?
MR. ROBERTS: Same age.
MR. LALLY: And as far as the activities and stuff?
MR. ROBERTS: Same baseball team. Yep.
MR. LALLY: So all three of the kids played baseball together for several years?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now at some point, did Mr. O'Keefe move away from that house?
MR. ROBERTS: He did, he did. He moved to one Meadows.
MR. LALLY: And sort of from your house, where was that in relation?
MR. ROBERTS: Probably two, two or three miles. A lot further away.
MR. LALLY: A lot further away, sort of on the south side of Canton? Is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: That's correct.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall about what year it was that the kids moved over?
MR. ROBERTS: Oh, maybe 2019. Maybe. I'm not sure of that.
MR. LALLY: Now at some point, through your knowing Mr. O'Keefe, did you come to know someone by the name of Karen? And when was it in relation to January 28th, 2022 — about how long before that was it that you met Karen?
MR. ROBERTS: Probably a couple — maybe a year and a — a year or two. About a year or two before. Yes. I don't — I don't recall exactly.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall when it was that you first met her?
MR. ROBERTS: I think she might have came to my house, maybe with John. I'm not — I, again, I — okay.
MR. LALLY: Now as far as what, if anything, did you know as far as the relationship between Miss Read and —
MR. ROBERTS: I don't — I don't understand. Who was Miss Read to Mr. O'Keefe?
MR. LALLY: Oh, girlfriend. Sorry. Nothing — it's your fault. It's entirely my question. Okay. So with respect — and just so we're clear as far as who we're talking about — do you see Miss Read in the courtroom today?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes, I do.
MR. LALLY: If you could just identify her — where is she seated, or describe an article of clothing?
MR. ROBERTS: She's seated right there.
MR. LALLY: I ask the record to reflect the identification of the witness. Thank you. Now as far as their relationship — and by "they" I mean Mr. O'Keefe — is that something that you talked to Mr. O'Keefe about?
MR. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And sort of vice versa, as far as your relationship with your wife — was that something that you talked to Mr. O'Keefe about?
MR. ROBERTS: No, no.
MR. LALLY: Now with regard to that particular evening, January 28th, 2022 — you mentioned at some point Mr. Camerano and/or Mr. O'Keefe reached out to you?
MR. ROBERTS: They did.
MR. LALLY: And what was that in regard to? What was that conversation?
MR. ROBERTS: They reached out — they were at McCarthy's, the bar in Canton Center, and they wanted me to come up. I was, you know, I didn't want to, I wanted to stay in because there was a storm coming. And then he called me a — and I, sorry, I — I can't let that happen, so I had to go. So I had to go up there.
MR. LALLY: And you recall who it was that called you?
MR. ROBERTS: It was Michael Camerano.
MR. LALLY: Let the record reflect. Okay. You received that text and you go to CF McCarthy's? Is that right?
MR. ROBERTS: That's right.
MR. LALLY: And you mention that's in Canton Center?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And about how far a drive is that from your house to CF's?
MR. ROBERTS: Two and a half, maybe three miles at best.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall about what time it was that you received that now infamous text — can you go make your way to CF's?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes. It was about 20 past 8.
MR. LALLY: Is that a place that you had been to before?
MR. ROBERTS: Not — not often, but I have been there
MR. LALLY: Before. When you arrived at CF McCarthy's, who, if anyone that you know, was there when you got there?
MR. ROBERTS: John O'Keefe and Michael Camerano.
MR. LALLY: And if you could, for the jury, just describe sort of the inside of CF McCarthy's — as far as you walk in the door, what is the layout of the bar?
MR. ROBERTS: Walk in the door, go to the left, and the bar's right in front of you — big square bar. And then the bathrooms are in the back, and there's tables off to the left.
MR. LALLY: And where in relation to the bar and the tables — where were Mr. O'Keefe and Mr. Camerano?
MR. ROBERTS: Walking to the left, they were on my left.
MR. LALLY: And the area where you came up to and where they were — that's essentially the same area that you and the group that you were with stayed in for most of the night?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And you went out to a bar — you had something to drink?
MR. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: You recall what you were drinking that night?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe it was a Bud Light.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall whether that was draft or a bottle?
MR. ROBERTS: It was a bottle.
MR. LALLY: Is that sort of typically what you would drink when you go out?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And with regard to Mr. Camerano and Mr. O'Keefe — you recall what they were drinking that night?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe the same — the same as me. I think — I believe — I wasn't much paying attention to that, but that's what they normally would drink. With the —
MR. LALLY: With the court's permission, if I could publish to the jury portions of what's been marked as Exhibit 50.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. LALLY: Miss Gilman, if I could ask for the second video — and if I could ask you to bring it forward to 34 minutes and 10 seconds. If you could pause it there just a moment. Now, Mr. Roberts, directing your attention to the screen — what's been marked as Exhibit 50. Also, I believe there should be a laser pointer on the desk in front of you. If you just click on that button and point it in a direction, you can highlight. So if I could ask you first of all — do you recognize what's depicted up on the screen as Exhibit 50?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And what do you recognize it to be, sir?
MR. ROBERTS: I see John right there, and Michael right there.
MR. LALLY: Does this appear to be consistent with what you recollect as far as the interior of CF McCarthy's on January 28th?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And the area that you just pointed out — as far as where Mr. O'Keefe and Mr. Camerano are — is that the area where you just testified that they essentially were during the time you were there?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes, it is.
MR. LALLY: Now with respect to Mr. O'Keefe, you can see sort of what he's wearing in this video. Is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And the clothing — at least as far as you can see — is that the clothing that you observed Mr. O'Keefe to be
MR. ROBERTS: Wearing? Yes, that was what he was wearing.
MR. LALLY: And Miss Gilman, if you could — I would ask just to play this from the 34:10 mark until 35. Pause just a moment. The gentleman that just came in through the door — do you recognize him, sir?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes, I do.
MR. LALLY: And who do you recognize him to be?
MR. ROBERTS: That's me.
MR. LALLY: So that was about the time that you arrived. Is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Just continue for another few seconds. Directing your attention still to the screen, Mr. Roberts — there's another individual around yourself, Mr. O'Keefe, Mr. Camerano — was that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you recognize who that person is?
MR. ROBERTS: At the time I didn't know — I didn't know. It doesn't look the same in this picture right now, but I believe it's Sully.
MR. LALLY: And that's someone — at this time, on January 28th — you didn't know who that was?
MR. ROBERTS: No, I did not.
MR. LALLY: But you now do?
MR. ROBERTS: I do now. Yes.
MR. LALLY: Okay. Who do you know him to be in relation to yourself and Mr. Camerano and Mr. O'Keefe?
MR. ROBERTS: Well, I know his son played baseball on my son's baseball team, and I met him that night — we were talking.
MR. LALLY: This would have been the first time that you met this person you now know as Sully?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Thanks. Now with reference to this evening — at some point did anyone else come into the bar and join your group?
MR. ROBERTS: Karen Read.
MR. LALLY: And that was sometime after you had initially arrived. Is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe so. Yes. It was after I had already been there, I believe.
MR. LALLY: And Miss Gilman, if I could — from the same exhibit, going to the fourth video down — and if I could ask you to bring it up to 22 minutes and 20 seconds. Pause there. Now as far as Miss Read — you see Miss Read in this video?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes, I do.
MR. LALLY: And if you could, just using that laser pointer, direct us to where you see her.
MR. ROBERTS: indicates Right there.
MR. LALLY: Now, Mr. Roberts, you were a little reluctant to come out that evening. Is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: That's correct.
MR. LALLY: And as far as timing — about how long was it that you stayed at CF McCarthy's before you left?
MR. ROBERTS: Good hour — when I — hour. So I was home by about 10, 10:15. I was home.
MR. LALLY: And if you recall, about how many beers did you have while you were there?
MR. ROBERTS: Probably three or four.
MR. LALLY: And what you were drinking — as far as amount was concerned — was that the same, less, or more so than the other people you were with?
MR. ROBERTS: Probably — probably one more, I would think. I kind of drank them kind of fast because I was ticked off.
MR. LALLY: So you may have lapped them by a round or something?
MR. ROBERTS: Sure. Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, you mentioned what you and Mr. O'Keefe and Mr. Camerano were drinking. What, if anything, did you observe Miss Read to be drinking at that point?
MR. ROBERTS: It was a clear glass with probably a lime in it — I'm assuming a vodka, maybe. I'm not exactly positive what it was, but it was a clear glass.
MR. LALLY: And from your prior interactions and socialization with Miss Read — is that something that she typically drinks?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes, I guess I would say.
MR. LALLY: And about what time was it again that you left?
MR. ROBERTS: I think I left about 10 — 10:00. Took me a few minutes to get home.
MR. LALLY: And with regard to when you left — did you sort of announce that to anybody, or how did you do it?
MR. ROBERTS: I usually don't, because then I'll have to deal with it again. But we walked out — I did — me and Michael Camerano, I believe, about the same time. I might have been a minute or two before him, that's all.
MR. LALLY: So you sort of exit and leave, and then at some point in time around the time that you left, Mr. Camerano left as well?
MR. ROBERTS: That's right.
MR. LALLY: And Miss Gilman, from what's up here — Exhibit 50 — if I could ask you to just from this point, about 22 minutes and 50 seconds. And thank you, Miss Gilman, you can take that down. [unintelligible] Correct?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe so, yes.
MR. LALLY: So, fair to say that was about the time you left. And with regard to — during the time that you were at CF McCarthy's with this group, including yourself, Mr. O'Keefe, Mr. Camerano, and Miss Read — how would you describe sort of the general tone or demeanor of the group?
MR. ROBERTS: Everything very normal — just a few friends out having some drinks, nothing that stands out, no arguing, no anything. No.
MR. LALLY: And as far as the clothing that I asked you about — with regard to what Mr. O'Keefe was wearing when you were there that night — did you notice anything as far as tears in the clothing or any dishevelment, anything like that?
MR. ROBERTS: No, I didn't notice anything.
MR. LALLY: And when you were there and you were talking to Mr. O'Keefe, what if any injuries or anything about him did you note as far as his face or anything else that you could see?
MR. ROBERTS: Nothing, no.
MR. LALLY: Now, once you left, where did you go?
MR. ROBERTS: I went home.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall when you got home — I think you've already said it — but about what time was it that you got home?
MR. ROBERTS: About 10:15 would be my best guess.
MR. LALLY: When you got home, anyone else from your house, from your family — was anyone there?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe my wife and my kids were there. They were up in bed but they weren't downstairs.
MR. LALLY: And at some point, did you go to bed that evening?
MR. ROBERTS: I did.
MR. LALLY: And about what time?
MR. ROBERTS: Probably — I saw the snow start coming down — probably 11:30, 12, maybe midnight.
MR. LALLY: And about the time you — you mentioned that you had been aware that there was a storm coming in, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: About the time that you went to bed around midnight or so, what if anything did you observe — did you look outside or see anything?
MR. ROBERTS: It was snowing.
MR. LALLY: And in relation to that, what if anything could you hear while you were in the house?
MR. ROBERTS: The wind was hitting the windows. You just knew it was a storm.
MR. LALLY: Now you go to sleep with your wife, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: That's right, yes.
MR. LALLY: At some point the next morning, on the 29th, what if anything is it that wakes you up?
MR. ROBERTS: A voice on my wife's phone — yelling, screaming, frantic — and that woke me up. So I asked, you know, what is that.
MR. LALLY: And initially, did you recognize that voice on your wife's phone?
MR. ROBERTS: I didn't recognize it — I just couldn't make out the words, but it was just screaming.
MR. LALLY: And could you hear anything — you couldn't make out the words?
MR. ROBERTS: I couldn't make out the words, no.
MR. LALLY: And at some point did you recognize that voice or come to find out who was on the other end of the phone?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes, I did. It was Karen Read.
MR. LALLY: And about what time of the morning was that?
MR. ROBERTS: I'd say 5:00 — that'd be a good guess.
MR. LALLY: And so you wake up, you hear the screaming — what happened?
MR. ROBERTS: My wife gets up, she's getting all crazy, then putting our clothes on and running out. I'm telling her not to go because the weather was pretty bad at that point.
MR. LALLY: And of course she goes?
MR. ROBERTS: She doesn't listen to me — she continues to get dressed and go, yes.
MR. LALLY: And when you say the weather was pretty bad at that point, can you expound upon that?
MR. ROBERTS: It was snowing, it was very windy, it was snowing heavy.
MR. LALLY: And your wife Kerry — did she say where she was going?
MR. ROBERTS: Said John's missing and I've got to go. I don't know exactly where she said she was going.
MR. LALLY: And from the time that you initially wake up around 5:00 a.m. or so — to the screaming on the phone, to the time that your wife Miss Roberts leaves your house — how much time elapsed between those two things?
MR. ROBERTS: By the time I woke up until she left, I'd say 15 minutes.
MR. LALLY: And when your wife leaves the house, she's driving, is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: She was.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall which car she took?
MR. ROBERTS: She took her Ford Explorer.
MR. LALLY: That's an SUV, is that correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall what color the Ford Explorer was?
MR. ROBERTS: It's gray.
MR. LALLY: Now after she leaves, when is the next time that you spoke to your wife?
MR. ROBERTS: She called me on the phone — I can't really recall exact times now. They tell me that they found John, he's in the ambulance, they're bringing him to the hospital, and she was going to get Mr. and Mrs. O'Keefe.
MR. LALLY: And by Mr. and Mrs. O'Keefe, who did you understand that to be?
MR. ROBERTS: John's parents.
MR. LALLY: And did you know John's parents?
MR. ROBERTS: I did.
MR. LALLY: Did you know where they lived?
MR. ROBERTS: In Braintree.
MR. LALLY: So your wife calls you, tells you Mr. O'Keefe is in an ambulance and she's going to Braintree to get his parents?
MR. ROBERTS: That's right.
MR. LALLY: And after you heard that, what is it that you did next?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe I snowblowed the driveway, got it ready because I knew she was going to come home — you know, in a mood — clear your driveway so she could.
MR. LALLY: Yes, because it was — yes. Now, when you go out to clear the driveway — at the time that your wife calls you — about how much snow was in the driveway?
MR. ROBERTS: I'd say there were drifts of at least a foot or so. It was a lot — tough to get the car in.
MR. LALLY: And if you know, about what time was it that your wife returned home?
MR. ROBERTS: About 8:00 — I don't know the exact time.
MR. LALLY: And when you say 8:00, you mean 8:00 in the morning?
MR. ROBERTS: 8:00 a.m.
MR. LALLY: I may have just one moment. No further questions for this witness.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right. Cross-examination.
MR. YANNETTI: Good afternoon, sir.
MR. ROBERTS: Good afternoon.
MR. YANNETTI: Mr. Roberts, you and I have never met, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: That night that you went out to CF McCarthy's — where you were sort of pressured or goaded into going out — you did get a chance to observe John O'Keefe at the bar, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: I did, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: Did you ever see him wearing a puffy jacket?
MR. ROBERTS: Never.
MR. YANNETTI: Did you ever see a puffy jacket around his chair that he was sitting in?
MR. ROBERTS: Not that I recall.
MR. YANNETTI: Holding a puffy jacket?
MR. ROBERTS: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Now, you noticed on the video — one of the last videos that Mr. Lally played for you — that prior to your making the Irish exit, you did have some interaction with Karen Read, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe so, at the end.
MR. YANNETTI: You saw that the two of you were at one point face to face?
MR. ROBERTS: I did, for a brief — yes. Maybe 10 or 20 seconds.
MR. YANNETTI: Okay, that sounds fair?
MR. ROBERTS: It does.
MR. YANNETTI: And when you were face to face, you were looking at her and she was looking at you, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And there was some type of interchange between the two of you — maybe I was saying goodbye, I don't know — you probably don't remember the specifics of the conversation, but there appeared to be some type of small conversation?
MR. ROBERTS: I saw her from the video, yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And while you were speaking to her, you had no indication that she was slurring her words in any way, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: I didn't think so, no.
MR. YANNETTI: Her eyes didn't appear to be bloodshot and glassy, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: She wasn't swaying or stumbling in any way, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: She didn't appear to be confused in her thinking or her speech?
MR. ROBERTS: She did not.
MR. YANNETTI: She appeared to be normal, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: There was nothing about her demeanor or her interaction with you that would lead you to believe that she was under the influence of alcohol at that time?
MR. ROBERTS: No.
MR. YANNETTI: And during the time that you spent with them at the bar, you didn't see any evidence of any problems between Karen and John O'Keefe?
MR. ROBERTS: I did not.
MR. YANNETTI: No arguments or bickering or anything like that?
MR. ROBERTS: No.
MR. YANNETTI: Neither one of them was complaining about the other, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Were you able to see any affection between the two of them, either physically or with regard to what they were saying?
MR. ROBERTS: I didn't see any — any...
MR. YANNETTI: Seems like you were more concentrated on—
MR. ROBERTS: I was talking with the guys — we were talking with Mike at the bar.
MR. YANNETTI: But you had known Karen, or at least known of her, and had some interactions with her for — I believe your testimony was — about a year or two?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: During that time there was some interaction with Karen at your house because there were pickups and drop-offs that had to be made?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And you would see that Karen had been to your house when you were there, specifically to pick up your son, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: How often would that occur?
MR. ROBERTS: I don't recall — not many times, maybe.
PARENTHETICAL: [sidebar — gap to 3:45:09]
MR. YANNETTI: And she would pick him up to either take him to school, sports, or some activity, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: I believe it was normally like baseball, maybe. I don't know — I don't arrange that stuff, my wife takes care of that, so I don't arrange the pickups — it's usually my wife that does that. So I don't — I can't tell you exactly what it was for.
MR. YANNETTI: No, I understand. I'm just getting the fact that you were present when these pickups occurred?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And that would be because Karen was shuttling — you know — either Kaylee or Patrick to events, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: And when there was an intersection with specifically Patrick and your son, she would take both of them, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. YANNETTI: And from your observations of Karen Read during those — you know — one or two years that you would come into contact with her, the contact you had was mainly surrounding what happened with the kids, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Yeah, I ...would say she appeared to be responsible.
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained. Ask it differently.
MR. YANNETTI: Sure. She appeared to be caring toward the kids, did she not?
MR. LALLY: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Overruled. May we approach? Okay. Do feel free to stand up and stretch.
MR. YANNETTI: Just one question for you, just to sort of alter the last question that I asked you. From your read on this, it appeared to you as though Karen was caring for the kids and caring about them. Correct?
MR. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. YANNETTI: Nothing.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay. Any followup, Mr. Lally?
MR. LALLY: Briefly. Just one question, sir. As far as your observations of Miss Read in regard to Mr. O'Keefe, and in regard to the children, that was what you observed, correct?
MR. ROBERTS: That's right.
MR. LALLY: And so as far as what, if anything, went on behind closed doors or in their relationship, you weren't really privy to that.
MR. ROBERTS: I was not.
MR. LALLY: Okay, nothing further.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right, Mr. Roberts, you are all set, sir. Thank you.
MR. ROBERTS: Thank you.