Commonwealth v. Read — Trial ArchiveKerry Roberts - Direct
837 linesCOURT OFFICER: Raise your hand. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? Thank you. Take the stand.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right, Mr. Lally.
MR. LALLY: Good morning.
MS. ROBERTS: Good morning.
MR. LALLY: Good morning. If you would please state your name and spell your last name for the record.
MS. ROBERTS: Kerry Roberts. R-O-B-E-R-T-S.
MR. LALLY: And where do you live, ma'am?
MS. ROBERTS: Canton, Mass.
MR. LALLY: And how long have you lived in Canton, Mass.?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, 10 years.
MR. LALLY: And who, if anyone, do you live in Canton with?
MS. ROBERTS: My husband, my two children.
MR. LALLY: And your two children — how old are they? Boy, girl?
MS. ROBERTS: Uh, my son is 12, my daughter's 14.
MR. LALLY: And do you work, ma'am?
MS. ROBERTS: I do.
MR. LALLY: What do you do for work?
MS. ROBERTS: I'm an executive assistant.
MR. LALLY: How long have you been doing this?
MS. ROBERTS: 17 years.
MR. LALLY: And your husband — does he work as well?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: What does he do for work?
MS. ROBERTS: He's a heavy equipment operator.
MR. LALLY: How long has he been doing that?
MS. ROBERTS: Maybe 20, 22 years — 20-plus years.
MR. LALLY: Now, if I could turn your attention to the evening of January 28th, 2022, into the morning of the 29th — do you recall those days?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall what days of the week they were?
MS. ROBERTS: Say it again?
MR. LALLY: Do you recall what days of the week they were?
MS. ROBERTS: Uh, Friday. So, the 28th, Friday; the 29th, Saturday.
MR. LALLY: Now, on the evening of the 28th, do you recall what you were doing?
MS. ROBERTS: I was bowling with my daughter and her friends and one of the mothers.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall where that was?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, Westgate Lanes in Brockton.
MR. LALLY: And about what time was it that you got home from that?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, probably about 8:30-ish, because there was a storm coming. So we wanted to be home. I didn't want to be out late.
MR. LALLY: And when you got home — you and your daughter — is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Say that one more time.
MR. LALLY: You and your daughter came home around 8:30 or so?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Was anyone else from your house home when you got there?
MS. ROBERTS: I think my husband was home — he was going out. I think I passed him and he was heading out to meet his friends. My son was not home.
MR. LALLY: And who were the friends that he was going out to meet?
MS. ROBERTS: Uh, John O'Keefe and Michael Camerano.
MR. LALLY: So, I'd like to start with just Mr. Camerano. How do you know him?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, he's been childhood friends with my husband.
MR. LALLY: And do you know where your— —husband was going to meet Mr. Camerano and Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: C.F. McCarthy's. Um, it's a bar in Canton, sort of in the center of town.
MR. LALLY: Is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And Mr. O'Keefe — how do you know him?
MS. ROBERTS: I've known him since high school.
MR. LALLY: And where did you go to high school?
MS. ROBERTS: Braintree High School.
MR. LALLY: And how is it that you came to know Mr. O'Keefe? How would you describe your relationship with Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: He was one of my closest friends, um, in addition to [unintelligible], uh, through growing up and going to Braintree High.
MR. LALLY: Were you familiar with any other members of the O'Keefe family?
MS. ROBERTS: Uh, yes. Kristen, his sister — she was a senior when I was a freshman. Um, John was a year older than me, and Paul was two years younger. So at some point I was in school with all of them.
MR. LALLY: And after high school, at some point, did you come to know any of the members of the O'Keefe family while you were living in Canton?
MS. ROBERTS: Uh, yes. My son and, um, John's nephew went to an in-home daycare together. So I went to go pick up my son at one point, and Kristen was there, and we kind of figured out that we lived in the same neighborhood that we were going to be moving into. And then Kristen got sick.
MR. LALLY: And during that time — sort of when you first reconnected with Kristen — about how old was your son? And her son?
MS. ROBERTS: My son was 18 months. Patrick — he's almost a year older.
MR. LALLY: And your son and Patrick— Furbush — did they end up going to the same school in Canton?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes. They went to home daycare, they went to preschool, pre-K, and by the time they got to elementary school they got separated because they were troublemakers.
MR. LALLY: And did they go to the same school all throughout?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And what other activities did your son do along with Kristen's son Patrick?
MS. ROBERTS: Well, Patrick wanted to try hockey, so they did hockey together, and then he didn't like that. And they've played baseball together since they were T-ball, like four or five.
MR. LALLY: Now, you mentioned that Kristen — Kristen Furbush — at some point after you met her, she got sick. Is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Eventually she passed away. Is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: After she passed away, her husband also passed away. Correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And at some point after that, what if any role did John O'Keefe have with reference to —
MS. ROBERTS: Well, when Kristen passed away I was in touch with John, just seeing if they needed help with the kids getting them to and from wherever, because I was down the street. Kristen passed away and then he said, "I might move in — Steve's got to figure out finances, but I might move into your neighborhood." I said, "Oh, okay." And then when Steve died, John did move in and he took over raising the kids.
MR. LALLY: And fair to say that you were — — with reference to your son being friends with his nephew Patrick — you would see him fairly often, and by "him" I mean John O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: Oh yes, daily.
MR. LALLY: And at some point did John and his niece and nephew move from down the street from your house?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes, they moved across town. So I live on the Milton side; he moved over sort of near the Stoughton side.
MR. LALLY: About how far a drive is that from your house to where they moved to?
MS. ROBERTS: It was on Meadows — correct, yes. It depends because Canton's terrible for traffic. Maybe seven minutes, maybe eight depending, and if it's in the evening it's longer.
MR. LALLY: And after Mr. O'Keefe and his niece and his nephew moved sort of across — town, where did his nephew Patrick go to school?
MS. ROBERTS: He remained at the same school that he was at with my son. So on Wednesdays when John couldn't grab him in time because he'd be working in the city, Patrick would come home with me.
MR. LALLY: Are you familiar with what Mr. O'Keefe did for a living?
MS. ROBERTS: He was a Boston police officer, but at the time he was working in an office registering sex offenders.
MR. LALLY: And so you would help out as far as picking up his nephew. What if any assistance did you have with regard to his niece Kaye as well?
MS. ROBERTS: Say that one more time.
MR. LALLY: What if any assistance did you have with regard to Mr. O'Keefe's schedule with regard to his niece Kaye?
MS. ROBERTS: I didn't — I didn't take care of Kaylee as much. That was — sort of there were other women. Jen McCabe was one of them. She sort of really took hold of caring for Kaye because her daughter was friends with Kaye, and I sort of got Patrick.
JUDGE CANNONE: You have to keep your voice up. I'm sorry — I didn't mean to interrupt you. If you could keep your voice up too.
MS. ROBERTS: Okay. [unintelligible]
MR. LALLY: And through the years that you knew Mr. O'Keefe, when he lived in Canton, and your being friends with him, what if any conversations would you have with Mr. O'Keefe in regard to any sort of relationships or dating or anything like that?
MS. ROBERTS: Well, he dated a lot of people, so it depends for conversations with —
MR. LALLY: What if any sort of role would you have, or what if any knowledge would you have, in reference to people that he dated?
MS. ROBERTS: My husband — whenever he would go on a date with somebody, he would have my husband come meet them, sort of saying, "What do you think?" And he — I mean, he had a couple of girlfriends that were very — nice.
MR. LALLY: Now, at some point did you become aware of a person by the name of Karen?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And when was it and how was it that you first came to know that person?
MS. ROBERTS: John called me and said, "Karen and I are going to stop by," because we had people over, and I said, "Who is Karen?" — because I didn't know if he was going to bring someone from high school and surprise me with a random — I had never heard of her. And he said, "You know who Karen is — the girl I'm dating." I said, "Nope, but okay." And then they came over that night.
MR. LALLY: And when about was that?
MS. ROBERTS: I think it was sometime in July.
MR. LALLY: And July what year?
MS. ROBERTS: What are we — 2020?
MR. LALLY: 2020.
MS. ROBERTS: Sometime shortly after sort of the — COVID pandemic, yes.
MR. LALLY: How would you describe your relationship, if any, with Karen?
MS. ROBERTS: She was like another person that took care of the kids. She took care of Kaye and Patrick a lot, so I would coordinate with her if Ryan and Patrick were going to go to the golf range, or if Ryan was going to go with them to the Red Sox game — that kind of thing. We weren't doing lunch or hanging out like girlfriends.
MR. LALLY: Were there any occasions where you had socialization or would go out as couples or anything like that with Mr. —
MS. ROBERTS: No, just — they came over to our house one time, and then we'd do baseball tournaments down the Cape and we'd all get together, but the four of us never went out.
MR. LALLY: And just for clarity purposes, do you see Miss Read in the courtroom today?
MS. ROBERTS: Yep.
MR. LALLY: Identify her as to where she's seated or an article of clothing she's wearing.
MS. ROBERTS: Say that again?
MR. LALLY: Could you identify her as to where she's seated or an article of clothing that she's wearing?
MS. ROBERTS: She is seated at that front table and she has a black and white suit jacket.
MR. LALLY: I'll ask that the record reflect identification by the witness.
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, coming back to that evening of the 28th — your husband went out to meet Mr. Camerano and Mr. O'Keefe. Correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you know about what time it was that your husband Curt arrived home that — night?
MS. ROBERTS: Maybe around 10:30.
MR. LALLY: And after he arrived home, what if anything specifically do you recall the two of you doing before going to sleep?
MS. ROBERTS: I remember sitting on the couch — the front door is right there and it was open — and it started to snow. It had just started to come down, probably about midnight, but it was coming down fast. So you knew those little snowflakes usually mean a big snowstorm, and I said, "It's starting," so we went to bed because we knew we weren't going out anywhere.
MR. LALLY: And turning your attention to the next morning — at some point you awoke. Do you recall what it was that awoke you that — morning on the 29th?
MS. ROBERTS: Karen called me at 5:00 in the morning.
MR. LALLY: And is that sort of a normal occurrence, as far as Miss Read calling you specifically that early?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And when you went to answer the phone, at some point did you look at the screen of your phone?
MS. ROBERTS: I — I don't know. I just —
MR. LALLY: Let me ask this in a different way. At some point did you realize or did you know whether or not the call that you answered — at some point you answered. Correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Okay. In the call that you answered, do you know whether or not that was the first call Miss Read had placed to you that morning, or no?
MS. ROBERTS: It was the second call, only from — looking at my phone after, because I said, "Oh shoot, she called me — she just called and I didn't —" She called twice.
MR. LALLY: And the phone call that you answered — about what time was that?
MS. ROBERTS: Five on the dot.
MR. LALLY: And if you know — from looking at your phone — the phone call that you didn't wake up for or didn't answer, do you know how long before that that phone call was?
MS. ROBERTS: I think it was a minute or two before.
MR. LALLY: So 5:00 on the dot you get a phone call, you answer it, and it's Miss Read. Is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And that phone number — you have her programmed into your phone as a contact. Is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And on prior occasions had you called that number or — gotten a call from that number on prior occasions?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And when you got that call or made that call, who was on the other end?
MS. ROBERTS: Say that again?
MR. LALLY: With reference to any prior phone calls that you either made or received with that number that you programmed in as Karen Read — when you spoke to someone by calling or receiving a call from that contact, who was on the other end of the call?
MS. ROBERTS: Karen Read.
MR. LALLY: Thanks. So you answer the phone sometime right around 5:00 a.m. Describe to the jury the content of that conversation.
MS. ROBERTS: I answered the phone and she said, "John's dead, Kerry, Kerry, Kerry," and then she hung up.
MR. LALLY: And as far as her ending the conversation — did you say anything or get a chance to say anything before she hung up?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And when she was speaking to you and saying those words to you over the phone, how loudly was she saying those words?
MS. ROBERTS: Very loud. She woke my husband, who was sleeping.
MR. LALLY: At the time that the phone rings and you pick it up, your husband's sleeping. Correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And then afterwards he's awake. Correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Now, what happened then?
MS. ROBERTS: Then I got out of bed and Curt said, "What was that?" I said, "I don't know, I don't know, something's happening." And I think I started getting dressed at that point, because — I don't know if I started getting dressed at that point or after she called back again. I tried to call her back a couple of times, to be like, "What — what is going on?" Finally she called me back again and she said, "I'm afraid John might be dead. He might have gotten hit by a plow. He did not come home last night. I was not supposed to stay in Canton last night. And he would never leave Kaye alone. I think something happened."
MR. LALLY: And do you recall earlier in the day of the 28th having any communication with either Mr. O'Keefe or Miss Read?
MS. ROBERTS: I did, with John. He texted me.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall generally what —
MS. ROBERTS: That was about — my son got into a scuffle with some boy at school, and Patrick wasn't in school at the time. I think he went to a doctor's appointment, but Patrick got wind of it, so John was calling to see if my son was okay.
MR. LALLY: Now, turning back to again that morning on the 29th — you called Miss Read a couple times, she didn't answer. Is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And at some point she calls you back, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And about how long was it after that initial phone call — she hung up — how much time elapsed between that call and the next?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know, maybe five minutes.
MR. LALLY: And so when she calls back, she makes those statements to you that you just said. And upon her making those statements, what, if anything, was your response?
MS. ROBERTS: Um — I said — then she said she checked Kaye's phone to see if John had called. And I said, "Okay, where are you now?" And she said, "I'm driving. Can I come to your house? Will you drive my car? I don't remember anything from last night. We drank so much. I don't remember anything." And I said, "You need to go home and be with Kaye if she's there by herself. I'll go look for him," or something of that nature. Because I thought — I said, "You're going to get a DUI if you were drinking all night last night and you don't remember anything. You shouldn't be driving."
MR. LALLY: All right. So, next question please. When you were talking to her on the phone, what, if any, observations did you make of sort of how she was speaking?
MS. ROBERTS: She was very frantic, and her voice was elevated. She was very frantic.
MR. LALLY: And the loudness you were describing during the course of that first phone call — what, if any, observations with respect to that in regard to the second?
MS. ROBERTS: Same throughout. The rest of the day was the same.
MR. LALLY: Do you indicate to her that she needs to go home? Is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And what, if anything, did she say in response?
MS. ROBERTS: She said, "I'm going to come to your house. Will you drive my car?" And I said okay.
MR. LALLY: And after that, what did you do?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, I started getting dressed. I think that's when I started getting dressed, and my husband said, "Where are you going?" I said, "I don't know, something happened, John didn't come home, Karen's worried, so I'm going to go look, go help her." And he said, "You're not going anywhere, it's a blizzard." And I said, "Yes, yes I am." And I went downstairs, I started the car, cleared it off, and I sat there waiting, and she didn't come.
MR. LALLY: So — during the time that you're waiting in the car, do you know about how long a period it was that you were waiting in the car?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't. I would say at least 10 minutes, sitting in the car.
MR. LALLY: And to that point, as far as when you went outside to the car — what, if anything, did you observe about the weather, and what, if anything, did you do with your car?
MS. ROBERTS: I cleaned the car off, I turned the car on, I got in it, and I thought to myself, well, she thinks he might have got hit by a plow or something, I'll see if there's any accidents. So I called the Canton non-emergency line and I said have there been any plow accidents, my friend's boyfriend didn't come home. And they said no, there were no accidents. So then I called Good Samaritan Hospital in Milton to see if anybody had been brought in in a car accident. They said no. And then finally Karen called back —
MR. LALLY: Before — um, before we get to that, just in reference to — at any point in time, did you call Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And when you called Mr. O'Keefe, were you able to speak to Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: Do you know how many times you called Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: My husband called him, and I think I called him.
MR. LALLY: And when was that in relation to you going out to your car and clearing it?
MS. ROBERTS: That was when I was in the house. Karen actually said, "Can you try and call him."
MR. LALLY: And you did, and you didn't get an answer, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And do you know whether or not your husband got an answer?
MS. ROBERTS: He did not.
MR. LALLY: So you go out to the car, you're waiting, and you make the phone call initially to Canton police. Is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you know who you spoke with at Canton police?
MS. ROBERTS: I believe it was Officer Goode.
MR. LALLY: Is that someone that you knew in any way prior to this date of January 29th?
MS. ROBERTS: We have mutual friends, but no, I'd never met him.
MR. LALLY: Now you call the hospitals, and then at some point after you finish speaking to the hospitals, the defendant then calls you back, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And what, if anything — can you describe to the jury sort of what was the content of that conversation — that third time?
MS. ROBERTS: Um — I said, "Where are you? Are you in the car?" And she said, "I'm at Jen's house." And I said, "Jen who?" She said, "Jen McCabe. She's going to drive my car." And I said, "Okay, stay there, I'll come to you — we'll drop your car off, we'll just take my car and go look for him." And I drove to Jen's and I pulled in the driveway behind them. I was still on speaker phone. Jen is driving, Karen's in the passenger seat. And we drove — I said, "Do you remember — look, did you look through the house? Could he be passed out somewhere in the house?" She said, "I don't know, I didn't look." So I said, "Let's do that. Let's — we're not taking two cars, it's a blizzard — we're going to go back to Meadows and we're going to go look in the house first.
MS. ROBERTS: He could be passed out behind the couch or on the floor, who knows." So we went to the house.
MR. LALLY: Yeah, I'm sorry — before you get into that — just as far as directionality and where you're going at this initial stage, you're sort of directing what's going to happen and where you're going to go, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Now, you had mentioned that the defendant said she was at Jen's house. You asked "Jen who?" And she said Jennifer McCabe, correct?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'll allow it.
MR. LALLY: With regards to Miss McCabe, did you know her, or how did you know her prior to this — prior to this morning of January 29th?
MS. ROBERTS: I had met her once. When John took her and I to Reebok — because he's got a 50% discount, so we would go periodically and get the kids' shoes — so she, John, and myself went to Reebok, got shoes, and then we went to the Hillside for lunch. That was it. I wasn't friends with her.
MR. LALLY: Is that someone that you had programmed in your phone as a contact — do you have her information prior to January 29th?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And when you went to Miss McCabe's house that morning, how was it that you knew where Miss McCabe's was?
MS. ROBERTS: I've picked up Kaye there a time or two for John and brought her home, if I was heading that way, because Jen's house is on the way to John's.
MR. LALLY: And so you go to Miss McCabe's house, and can you describe for the jury sort of what you observe or what you see when you're first pulling up?
MS. ROBERTS: I pulled in the driveway behind Karen's car, and Karen and Jen are in the car talking. I'm still on Bluetooth, so I can hear them. And Karen said that she remembered leaving him at Waterfall, and Jen said, "No, you — I saw you pull up to my sister's house." And then at some point in the conversation, she said, "What about my tail light? What about my tail light?" And I looked, and there was a piece missing, but it was caked on with snow — you could tell there was a little black hole, but there was snow like caked on it. And it was a blizzard at this point.
MR. LALLY: Now, just as far as over the course of this early morning — when you're making that drive from your house to Miss McCabe's house, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: So during that time, can you describe sort of what the lighting conditions were, what the roadway conditions were, what you observed as you were driving over there?
MS. ROBERTS: It was not light out yet, and it was really bad driving.
MR. LALLY: And bad driving — in reference to snow? Was that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: So you get to Miss McCabe's house, and during the drive from your house to Miss McCabe's house, you're speaking to both Miss McCabe and Miss Read?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And with reference — I think you've said a couple times — as far as a Bluetooth — so as far as what you're hearing on the other side of the conversation, is it just one person or are you able to hear sort of everything that's going on in the car?
MS. ROBERTS: I could hear everything. It was like a regular phone call in the car.
MR. LALLY: From where you were, your impression was it was hooked up to the speaker of the car, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And when you get to Miss McCabe's house — what you were just testifying about as far as the tail — when is it that you're making those observations in Jen's driveway? And about how far away from the defendant's car are you the first time that you see — or your attention is drawn to — this tail light?
MS. ROBERTS: I was parked right behind them in the driveway.
MR. LALLY: And can you describe which part of the vehicle you were looking at, as far as which tail light you're observing?
MS. ROBERTS: [unintelligible] — the right, passenger side.
MR. LALLY: And so from there, as far as Miss McCabe's driveway — you make these observations — where is it that you go from there?
MS. ROBERTS: Say it again?
MR. LALLY: So after you're making those observations and you're overhearing that conversation — or you're having that conversation over Bluetooth — where did the three of you go?
MS. ROBERTS: Went to Meadows, to John's house.
MR. LALLY: And how was it that each of you sort of got from Miss McCabe's house to John's house on Meadows?
MS. ROBERTS: Jen drove Karen's car, and I followed behind in my car.
MR. LALLY: And when you arrived there, where did you go, where did you park?
MS. ROBERTS: I pulled in — I think I pulled in right behind. She pulled her car sort of in front of the garage bays, and I pulled in the driveway behind her.
MR. LALLY: And when you say "she," do you know who
MS. ROBERTS: ...was driving. Jen McCabe. Sorry—driving, with Miss Read in the front passenger seat. Correct.
MR. LALLY: And you're driving your car behind. Correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: What kind of car did you have?
MS. ROBERTS: A Ford Explorer.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall what color it was?
MS. ROBERTS: Dark gray.
MR. LALLY: And as far as Miss Read, do you recall what kind of vehicle she had at that point?
MS. ROBERTS: A Lexus SUV.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall what color that was?
MS. ROBERTS: Black.
MR. LALLY: Now, with respect to Mr. O'Keefe, do you recall what kind of vehicle John O'Keefe had?
MS. ROBERTS: He has a Traverse.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall what color that was?
MS. ROBERTS: It's like a beige green.
MR. LALLY: Your Honor, with the Court's permission, if I could ask to publish what's been marked as exhibit number two?
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. LALLY: Ms. Roberts, your attention to the screen over here. Do you recognize what is up on the screen?
MS. ROBERTS: That's John's house.
MR. LALLY: And does that seem like a fair and accurate representation of what John's house looked like around the time of January 29th, when you went over that morning?
MS. ROBERTS: Much snowier, but yes. Sorry, I said it was much, much more snow, but yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, not visible in this particular photograph—with the driveway that you were talking about, facing Mr. O'Keefe's house at Meadows, as we are in this picture, whereabouts would the driveway be, to the left or to the right?
MS. ROBERTS: To the right.
MR. LALLY: And, Your Honor, with the Court's permission, if I could ask to publish what's been marked as exhibit 91?
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. LALLY: And again, Ms. Roberts, do you recognize what's up on the screen?
MS. ROBERTS: That is John's car.
MR. LALLY: And what is it that's behind John's car?
MS. ROBERTS: Behind a basketball hoop.
MR. LALLY: No—not the rear of the vehicle, but sort of in the photograph behind, on the other side of the passenger side?
MS. ROBERTS: Oh, the garage doors.
MR. LALLY: And there are two garage doors—on the left or right—is that this house we've been over a number of times, when he lived there?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And as far as what, if anything, were you familiar with as far as Mr. O'Keefe having, regarding security?
MS. ROBERTS: He has a Ring camera that was in the driveway and a Ring camera that was at the side door.
MR. LALLY: And with regard to the garage itself—as far as you've been in there as well?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And so, what is behind the left door of the—?
MS. ROBERTS: His big old blue convertible.
MR. LALLY: And on the right side of the garage, what, if anything, is in behind?
MS. ROBERTS: Nothing there. I mean, he's got all organized stuff and kids' sporting—I don't know if he parked in there or not.
MR. LALLY: Now, as far as how Mr. O'Keefe kept his garage, kept his home—was there a particular way in which he kept it?
MS. ROBERTS: He lived there, you know. Neat freak.
MR. LALLY: I'm sorry, what was that?
MS. ROBERTS: He was a neat freak.
MR. LALLY: Okay. And as you enter into the garage, what, if any, access would you then have to inside the home?
MS. ROBERTS: There's a set of stairs and it brings you right into like the mudroom, which leads into the kitchen.
MR. LALLY: Now, when you would go over to Mr. O'Keefe's house on this occasion, or on many occasions, were there rules or preferences Mr. O'Keefe would have with regard to footwear?
MS. ROBERTS: You did not wear footwear in the house. You took your shoes off.
MR. LALLY: And is that something that applied to people that lived there as well as people that were visiting?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And how would you describe it—is that a relatively strict rule?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, Your Honor, with the Court's permission, if I could—I'd like to publish a portion of exhibit 6, Ring video.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. LALLY: If I could have from the driveway, video number 4. So, Ms. Roberts, do you recognize what's up on the screen?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes. That's Karen's car and my car, and John's is in the background.
MR. LALLY: Now, in front of you on the desk there should be a laser pointer—
MS. ROBERTS: It's not—
MR. LALLY: Oh, thank you very much. Thank you. So pressing on that button and pointing toward the screen, if I could ask you to just direct the jury's attention to where you see Miss Read's vehicle, where you see your vehicle, and where you see—
MS. ROBERTS: That is John's car. That is Karen's car. That is my car.
MR. LALLY: Is this a fair and accurate portrayal of where the cars were and what things looked like when you first arrived at Mr. O'Keefe's house, coming from Ms. McCabe's?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, with reference to any individuals that you observe in this video, again using the laser pointer, could you draw the jury's attention to who you are observing?
MS. ROBERTS: That is Jen McCabe, and that is Karen Read, and that's me.
MR. LALLY: And at some point you enter in through the garage, is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
PARENTHETICAL: [Video plays]
MR. LALLY: Now, Ms. Roberts, with reference to the Ring video security system that Mr. O'Keefe had at his home—if you know—do you know who had access to that?
MR. LALLY: Now, as far as the garage doors were concerned, when you came back that morning, what, if anything, did you notice about the garage?
MS. ROBERTS: The right garage door wouldn't close.
MR. LALLY: So it was open when you arrived?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't recall if it was open when we arrived, but when we were leaving it wouldn't close.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall—do you have any idea of how that worked, like how you would open or close the garage door?
MS. ROBERTS: Yeah, there's a code on the side.
MR. LALLY: And at any point in time, when you noticed that the garage door was open, were you or any of the people that you were with able to close that door?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: So is that the door that you entered through in order to get into the garage, get into the mudroom, take off your shoes?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And when you came into the house that morning and you entered into the mudroom, what, if anything, did you do with your shoes, and what, if anything, did you observe Ms. McCabe and the defendant do with their shoes?
MS. ROBERTS: Jen and I both had taken our shoes off in the—in the sort of steps in the garage, before we entered into the mudroom. We took our shoes off, and Karen just walked in.
MR. LALLY: Go ahead, if you'd just play the video for—
MS. ROBERTS: I do not.
MR. LALLY: You obviously—you know whether or not Mr. O'Keefe had access to that?
MS. ROBERTS: He did. Yes.
MR. LALLY: Okay. Do you know how or what device he used in order to access it?
MS. ROBERTS: I only know he had it on his phone.
MR. LALLY: How do you know that?
MS. ROBERTS: Because he would check it all the time to see if the kids were home or dropped off.
MR. LALLY: Is that something he did in your presence?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, with regard to—at some point when you get to the home, beyond the sort of initial observations you made in McCabe's driveway with regard to the right rear passenger tail light of Ms. Read's vehicle—what, if any other, observations did you make, or what, if anything else, did you do with reference to that area of the vehicle?
MS. ROBERTS: Karen did point it out at one point in the driveway. She said, "My tail light—look at my tail light." And I looked at it, and I said, "You told me you don't remember anything from last night." She said, "Do you—do you think I hit him? Do you think I hit him?" And I said, "No, I don't think you hit him. I think you probably hit something, but let's just go in the house and look for him."
MR. LALLY: And so, as far as your recollection is concerned, that sort of interaction that you had—or looking at the tail light— when did that happen?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know if it was when—well, it obviously wasn't when we got there. It must have been when we were leaving to go out to look for him. I'm sorry—I wasn't sure if it was when we arrived or when we were leaving to go back out and look for him, but now that I've seen the video it's obviously when we came back out of the house.
MR. LALLY: Okay. And who was present for that?
MS. ROBERTS: Jen McCabe, Karen Read, and myself.
MR. LALLY: And as far as where Ms. McCabe parked that vehicle—at any point in time that you were at the house, did that vehicle move at all? And by that vehicle I mean Read's—?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't think so.
MR. LALLY: So where it's parked in that video is essentially where it stayed, as far as you know?
MS. ROBERTS: I believe so.
MR. LALLY: Now, with reference to those observations—when you were looking at the rear passenger tail light area of Ms. Read's vehicle—how close to the vehicle were you when you were making those observations?
MS. ROBERTS: Right in front of it. There was one piece—like a rectangle, encapsulated—like, whatever was broken, there was—I remember there was one piece of metal sort of sticking out. So if it was an encasement for a light of some sort, I remember looking at it and that piece was sort of sticking out, and I thought someone's going to catch their sleeve on that, or something. And—
MR. LALLY: Now, from there—when you arrive at the house, you go into the house, you take off your shoes—what happened?
MS. ROBERTS: I started looking. Jen started looking. Karen—I don't—they both—her and Jen went upstairs. I started looking downstairs. I started looking on the other side of the couches to see if maybe he passed out somewhere. And then I went upstairs, and Karen was standing in John's room. The bed was made. She was just standing there. Jen had gone in to talk to Kaye. And then I said, "All right, let's go. He's not in the house."
MR. LALLY: As far as "he's not in the house"—as far as your knowledge of Mr. O'Keefe, him not coming home—when any of the children were home — was that something that was normal, him not coming home if the children were home?
MS. ROBERTS: Yeah, he would not do that. And, uh, obviously you knew Kaye was there, but what if anything did you know as to where Patrick was?
MR. LALLY: Was he—
MS. ROBERTS: He was at a friend's house.
MR. LALLY: And was that something that you knew independent of this morning, or what had transpired up to that point?
MS. ROBERTS: Say that again.
MR. LALLY: How did you find out that Patrick was at a friend's house?
MS. ROBERTS: Karen said — I said, "Where's Patrick?" She said, "He's at his friend's."
MR. LALLY: So you were in the downstairs area of the home, is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And looking through the rooms, you didn't find Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct. No.
MR. LALLY: Now at any point in time did you go upstairs?
MS. ROBERTS: I did.
MR. LALLY: And when you went upstairs, where in the upstairs did you go?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, at the top of the stairs is John's bedroom, so I looked in there, I looked in the bathroom, I looked in the closet, I looked in Patrick's room, I looked in the other two bedrooms, and Kaye was in her room so Jen was in there. But I was looking through — just looking through the house.
MR. LALLY: And as far as Mr. O'Keefe's bedroom, when in there, what if anything did you observe as far as the condition of the bed?
MS. ROBERTS: The bed was made.
MR. LALLY: You mentioned you looked in a variety of different rooms on the second floor. You said sort of two other rooms. What if anything were those other rooms used for, if you know?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, I think one of them was a computer room. It was the room that faced the front of the house. And the back room had a bed in it that Mrs. O'Keefe would stay in when she would stay over.
MR. LALLY: And again, just to be clear, when you say Mrs. O'Keefe, do you mean John's mother?
MS. ROBERTS: John's mother. Sorry.
MR. LALLY: And as far as the computer room, who if anyone had access to that, if you know?
MS. ROBERTS: Had access to the computer room? Yes.
MR. LALLY: What was it used for?
MS. ROBERTS: Oh, there was a desk with a computer or laptop.
MR. LALLY: Do you know whose laptop that was — whether it was John's, whether it was the defendant's, whether it was the kids'?
MS. ROBERTS: Well, I — I don't know if it was the defendant's at the time, but John's laptop used to be in that room.
MR. LALLY: Um, you're on — with the Court's permission, I would ask if I could publish just a couple more photos on the screen for Ms. Roberts.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. LALLY: Miss Gilman, if I could start with Exhibit 92. Ms. Roberts, directing your attention up to the screen — you recognize what's depicted in that photograph?
MS. ROBERTS: That's Karen Read's Lexus.
MR. LALLY: And specifically, if you could, using the laser pointer in front of you, direct the jury's attention to where you observe damage.
MS. ROBERTS: That's where — that's where the metal piece I was describing was.
MR. LALLY: As far as what's depicted in this photograph up on the screen, is that consistent with what you observed in his driveway — Mr. O'Keefe's driveway — when you saw it, well, caked in snow?
MS. ROBERTS: But yes — snow — yes. Yes.
MR. LALLY: Ms. Roberts, you recognize what's depicted in this photograph?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: We have a closer up image of the same area, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
PARENTHETICAL: [unclear]
MR. LALLY: Ms. Roberts, I'm going to show you just two photographs — just look at those. Okay. And do you recognize those, or do you recognize what's depicted in those?
MR. LALLY: And what is depicted in the closer up image — is that also consistent with what you observed in the driveway?
MS. ROBERTS: Driveway? That — yes.
MR. LALLY: Your Honor, with the Court's permission, I would ask, again, if I could publish a portion of what's been marked as Exhibit 41.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
PARENTHETICAL: [sidebar]
PARENTHETICAL: [sidebar]
MR. LALLY: And Miss Gilman, if I could ask you to fast forward to about 2 hours, 9 minutes, and 30 seconds — still, to keep it paused there. Ms. Roberts, directing your attention up to the screen — you recognize what's on the paused portion of the screen?
MS. ROBERTS: That's John's house.
MR. LALLY: And again, Ms. Roberts, directing your attention up to the screen — you recognize what's sort of in front of the camera?
MS. ROBERTS: That's Karen's car and John's car.
MR. LALLY: And where you observe Karen's car and John's car — again, if you could, just using the laser pointer, direct the jury's attention to where you observe each of those.
MS. ROBERTS: This — that's Karen's car. That's John's car.
MR. LALLY: And those are essentially in the same positions that you were talking about, that the jury saw earlier in the Ring video from John O'Keefe's house?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: You may approach.
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Do you want this up on the screen or down?
MS. ROBERTS: Do I recognize — what's depicted in each of those photographs? Karen's car.
MR. LALLY: Okay. May I approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. LALLY: I'll introduce them — okay. Is there any objection? DEFENSE: No objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right, thank you.
MR. LALLY: While those are being marked, may we approach on —
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes, please.
MR. LALLY: Your Honor, with the Court's permission, I would ask to publish first what's been marked as Exhibit 101.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay.
MR. LALLY: And Ms. Roberts, what's up on the screen now is 101. You indicated that's Ms. Read — same position where Ms. Read left her car parked, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: This appears to be a still shot from the same video that you just saw in private?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: If I can have 102 now. And Ms. Roberts, what's up on the screen?
MS. ROBERTS: That's the second photograph that you showed me just a moment ago.
MR. LALLY: Yes. That's essentially a closer up, or zoomed in, image of what's in the same still image that you saw, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And again, if you could, using the laser pointer, just direct the jury's attention to the damage that you observe on the right passenger tail light of Ms. Read's vehicle.
MS. ROBERTS: indicates
MR. LALLY: Now you go — look through the home, you don't find Mr. O'Keefe — and what happens?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, then I said, "Let's go, let's go look for him." If — he might be walking home, or if you thought he got hit by a plow, let's just — and Jen and Karen wanted to go back to 34 Fairview, where they were at — Jen's sister's. Jen said she saw her pull up to 34 Fairview the night before. So Karen really wanted to go back there. I was the one that said, "No, let's drop a car off, go to Meadows and look through the house, and then we'll start looking if he's not in the house." So that's what we did — we got in the car and we were going to head back to Jen's sister's house.
MR. LALLY: And so this conversation as far as the defendant really wanting to go to Fairview — when did that occur in relation to when you got to Mr. O'Keefe's?
MS. ROBERTS: On the way from Jen McCabe's house to John's house, in the car.
MR. LALLY: So this is over the Bluetooth as you're driving?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes. Karen said, "I left him at Waterfall," and Jen said, "No, I saw you pull up in front of my sister's."
MR. LALLY: And so after coming out of Mr. O'Keefe's house, do you exit the same way that you entered?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes, come out the garage door, get in your car. Yes.
MR. LALLY: And if you could describe to the jury, sort of, where was everybody seated in your car when you did?
MS. ROBERTS: I was driving, Karen was in the back seat, and Jen was in the passenger seat.
MR. LALLY: And as far as Ms. McCabe's sister's house, at the time did you know where that was, or who her sister was, or anything like that?
MS. ROBERTS: I didn't even know she had a sister.
MR. LALLY: And about how long a drive — or how far a drive — or what the route was that you took going from Meadows to her sister's house?
MS. ROBERTS: I think we went main roads because we were looking — I mean, I don't know what we were looking for, but we were looking for him. I don't know if we thought he was walking home or if he got hit by a plow. So we went main roads. We pulled out — I think we went Bolivar Street, and then Jen was giving directions, 'cause I didn't know where we were going.
MR. LALLY: And to be clear — Bolivar Street, you're talking about — that's B-O-L-I-V-A-R?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And so then Ms. McCabe is then giving you directions as you're driving, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Now as you're driving, again, as far as — what if anything did you see as far as plows, or how were the roads treated at that time? What if anything did you observe with reference to that?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, it was bad driving. There were plows out, but it was really bad driving.
MR. LALLY: And the visibility as you were driving from Mr. O'Keefe's house to Ms. McCabe's sister's house — how would you describe the visibility?
MS. ROBERTS: It was very poor. It was in the middle of a blizzard.
MR. LALLY: Now when you get to the street, at some point you're directed by Ms. McCabe to Fairview Road, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And when you get to Fairview Road, you recall whether or not you took a left or a right, or how did you come onto Fairview?
MS. ROBERTS: I got off of Chapman Street. I took a right onto Fairview.
MR. LALLY: You took a right from Chapman onto Fairview, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And as you're coming down Fairview Road, what if anything did you note or observe as far as the sort of elevation of the roadway?
MS. ROBERTS: You go downhill. You go down a hill. Yes.
MR. LALLY: This particular area of Canton — obviously you've lived in Canton for several years — are you somewhat familiar with this area of
MS. ROBERTS: Canton, yeah.
MR. LALLY: And how is it that you were familiar with the area of Canton prior to this date, if you've never been to — [unintelligible] —
MS. ROBERTS: The commuter rail is right near there that I would take to work.
MR. LALLY: Are there any schools in that area as well?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes, the John F. Kennedy School. And my son and John's nephew also went to the home daycare across the street from the JFK.
MR. LALLY: Now, with the Court's permission, I would ask to just publish a brief portion of what's been marked as Exhibit 12. Okay, gentlemen, what I'm going to ask is if you could push this video forward to 2 minutes and 30 seconds. [unintelligible]: I'm sorry. Kerry Roberts, from what you've seen on the video, as far as what's depicted in this video, is that a fair and accurate representation consistent with what you observed that morning as you were driving around going from Mr. O'Keefe's house to Miss McCabe's?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And the turn that this vehicle is taking at this point in the video, about 2 minutes and 40 seconds in — do you recognize what street that vehicle was turning onto?
MS. ROBERTS: I believe it's Fairview — — Fairview.
MR. LALLY: Right there. Miss Roberts, as you're driving from Mr. O'Keefe's house to this address on Fairview Road that you've never been to before, what — what's going on inside the car?
MS. ROBERTS: Karen was frantic. She wouldn't put her seat belt on and I was getting nervous because we were driving in a blizzard. She kept leaning in between the two seats. I think at some point she was texting in the back seat and then she'd be leaning — she was just frantic the whole morning.
MR. LALLY: And as far as her screaming, do you recall anything specifically that she was screaming, or what if any sort of conversation was going on in the car as you were driving?
MS. ROBERTS: There was some — — conversation about a woman I didn't know, that was Bella's mom. And she said Bella's mom never liked me. I think Bella — Bella lived near Jen's sister, maybe. I don't know. Some conversation about Bella's mom, and Karen said she didn't like me.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall where you were in your travels when that topic of conversation came up?
MS. ROBERTS: No, I don't recall.
MR. LALLY: Now in reference to — following that, what if anything did you say in regards to any other sort of women? Any other — what — um, following that conversation in regard to Bella's mom who you didn't know, what if anything did you say or introduce into the conversation — mentioning Fairview Road?
MS. ROBERTS: — runs along Spring Lane. Spring — Spring Lane. So Spring Lane and Fairview are both off Chapman Street. And there was a woman he dated that lived on Spring Lane. So when Jen was telling me where her sister's house was, I said I don't know where Fairview is, and she said it's near Spring Lane, and I said oh, where the dance instructor lived. John had once dated a dance instructor. And then Karen said, do you think he could have gone there? Do you think that's where he could have been? No, I was — I was just using it as a reference point. She said it's near Spring Lane and I knew that the dance instructor lived on Spring Lane. And just —
MR. LALLY: — to be clear, when you say the dance instructor, this would be for his niece Kaylee, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And you indicated that the two of them — being Mr. O'Keefe and the dance instructor — had dated at some point?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: But how long ago was that?
MS. ROBERTS: Oh, it was when Kaylee was little. She was probably like five, so almost 10 years before this date.
MR. LALLY: That you're driving around now. As you're driving along and driving down Fairview, what is it that you're doing? What if anything do you observe Miss McCabe doing, and then what if anything do you observe?
MS. ROBERTS: Well, we were looking for John — walking, or wherever he may be. So I'm driving and looking on both sides, and I — — think Jen was looking on both sides, and Karen — she would be in the back seat, then she'd be in between us, then she'd be in the back seat, and then in between us.
MR. LALLY: And as you came down the hill on Fairview, what if anything happened?
MS. ROBERTS: Jen said my sister's house is right up here, and all of a sudden Karen said there he is, there he is, let me the f*** out of this car, and she started kicking the door.
MR. LALLY: How was she kicking the door — with her feet? How hard was she kicking?
MS. ROBERTS: Oh, pretty hard. I mean, she wanted to get out of the car, but it was locked, because once you start driving the back doors lock. So I — — looked over and I didn't see anything, and I looked at Jen and I said she's crazy, and I unlocked the door and I sat back and watched, and she ran over to a mound of snow.
MR. LALLY: And so at the time you're driving down the road, have you seen anything as you're driving, looking at the side of the road? Have you seen anything on your side of the vehicle?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And when you say she gets out of the vehicle, is it your side or the passenger side where Miss McCabe is?
MS. ROBERTS: The driver's side. She gets out of the back driver's-side door.
MR. LALLY: Correct. And how quickly does she go from your car to where — — she ends up?
MS. ROBERTS: She ran over to the mound.
MR. LALLY: And at that point in time, even when she runs over, could you see what she was running over to?
MS. ROBERTS: At some point I realized it was — it was the shape of a body.
MR. LALLY: And when was that — when in this sort of sequence were you able to realize that?
MS. ROBERTS: In seconds. Once she ran over to his body I said oh my God, and she lifted up his shirt and started to lay on him.
MR. LALLY: And when you stopped to let her out, where were you in relation to that mound of snow, or what you would learn it was?
MS. ROBERTS: I think my car was like in the middle of the road. I just stopped.
MR. LALLY: And in relation to where the mound of snow was, had you driven past it at that point? So where was it?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes, so it was located behind my vehicle.
MR. LALLY: Miss Gilman, if you could, I would ask just to play that at about 6 minutes in. Okay, what's depicted on the screen in front of you — this camera angle — do you recognize what that is?
MS. ROBERTS: That's my car.
MR. LALLY: Is that essentially where you parked your car when Miss Read started kicking the doors and got out and ran over?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now from this video, do you see where in relation to your vehicle Mr. O'Keefe was found? With the pointer, Miss Gilman, if you could for about — [unintelligible]: — back. [unintelligible]
MS. ROBERTS: On screen again — that is Jen McCabe, that's Karen Read, that's me.
MR. LALLY: Roberts, um, in relation to what you just saw in the video — as far as at some point, uh, the rear sort of tailgate or hatchback on your SUV that was in the up position — is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall why that was?
MS. ROBERTS: Because I was having Jen get the baby blankets to wrap around him out of my car.
MR. LALLY: And is that something that you just sort of have in the back of your car at all times?
MS. ROBERTS: Yeah.
MR. LALLY: Now at any point in time, uh, in that sequence, um, did you call anybody, or have any sort of phone calls that you made that went to voicemail at that time?
MS. ROBERTS: Did I? Yes, um, I don't know.
MR. LALLY: And so nothing that you recall — is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And did you observe Miss McCabe making any phone calls that just sort of went to voicemail, and she left her phone in your car?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. LALLY: Let me take it back. Um, for when you're pulling — so as far as the conditions when you pull up, um, and the defendant is banging on the door and gets out and runs over to Mr. — um, what's depicted in that video, obviously without your vehicle being in the middle of the roadway, is that a fair and accurate portrayal of what the road looked like and sort of what you saw upon your arrival?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Um, so after the defendant gets out of the vehicle, what did you do? Where did you go?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, when I realized it was him or someone — — um, I ran over and I dug his head out, grabbed the snow, and —
MR. LALLY: And you recall — um, you recognized the person in the snow was Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: Once I dug his head out, yes.
MR. LALLY: And you recall how his body was positioned — as far as, um, how was he, on his stomach, on his back, on his side?
MS. ROBERTS: He was on his back.
MR. LALLY: And so you brushed the snow away from his head, is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Off his face.
MR. LALLY: And when you were brushing the snow off his face, what if anything did you observe about his face, or the condition of —
MS. ROBERTS: He had blood coming out of his nose and his mouth, and his right eye — it looked like a golf ball. His left eye was fine. The right eye looked like a golf ball.
MR. LALLY: Now you mentioned that you wiped some snow from around his head — what if anything else did you observe on the rest of his body?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, he was bleeding in the back of the head. So when I was wrapping — I don't know why I was wrapping blankets around his head, but I just — I didn't know. Um, he had a cut on the back of his head.
MR. LALLY: You recall which side of his head that cut was on?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't — it just was blood on the blanket that was under his head.
MR. LALLY: Now as far as the rest of his body, did that have snow on it as well?
MS. ROBERTS: Say it again, I'm sorry?
MR. LALLY: The rest of his body — separate from his head area — what if any snow did you observe on the rest
MS. ROBERTS: Of his body? Um, he was completely covered.
MR. LALLY: And, you know, about how much snow was covering the rest of his body?
MS. ROBERTS: I would say like four inches, maybe three — I don't really — I don't really remember exactly how many, but he was covered.
MR. LALLY: And, uh, so with reference to Mr. O'Keefe — and when you arrive there, three of you being you, the defendant, and Miss McCabe — um, what is it that you were doing when you first sort of come over to him?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, well, Karen was laying on top of him, and I told her to get off him because I was going to do CPR, and I said, "Jen, you need to call 911." Um, and I started CPR on his chest — compressions — and then Karen was giving him mouth to mouth.
MR. LALLY: And as far as CPR goes, is that something that you had any training in prior to this?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And can you tell the jury a little bit about that — as far as what if any training did you have as far as CPR?
MS. ROBERTS: I get CPR certified every two years through the American Red Cross at work.
MR. LALLY: So you start doing chest compressions, is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And you direct Miss McCabe to call 911?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And what was the defendant doing at that?
MS. ROBERTS: She was doing mouth to mouth and she was frantic again, running around.
MR. LALLY: And as she was running around, what if anything else was she doing or saying while she was running around?
MS. ROBERTS: Um — "Did I hit him, did I hit him, is he dead, is he dead."
MR. LALLY: Is that something that she said once or more than once?
MS. ROBERTS: More than once.
MR. LALLY: And similar to sort of the tonality or the volume of the voice that you were describing before — was that consistent when you're there sort of in front of the house?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now in relation to where you were with Mr. O'Keefe — uh, obviously you've never been in that house before, is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: Um, what if anything did you observe as far as overhead lights or street lights or anything like that around that area where you found Mr. O'Keefe?
MS. ROBERTS: There was a fire hydrant and there was some weird like electrical box thing sticking out of the ground.
MR. LALLY: But you don't recall any sort of overhead lights or anything like that?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't recall.
MR. LALLY: Now, um, this process of you sort of doing compressions, um, and Miss Read is doing mouth to mouth and then running around — is the mouth to mouth that she's doing, is that sort of consistent, or is it intermittent? When is the running around in relation to the mouth to mouth?
MS. ROBERTS: Uh, I don't remember which was first. I was just doing — I was concentrating on doing chest compressions.
MR. LALLY: And so while you're doing the chest compressions, at some point do the First Responders start to arrive?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And about how long was it from the time that you sort of get out of the vehicle, go over, realize it's O'Keefe, et cetera, and to when the First Responders were —?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know — wasn't long, maybe under 10 minutes.
MR. LALLY: During that time, um, or during any of the amount of time that you were there, did you see anybody from any of the houses on the street come out of the house, or any neighbors come out, or anything like that?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: Um, once — if you recall — do you recall whether it was police or fire or ambulance, or who showed up first?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know. I think the police showed up first — so the EMTs — I just know the EMTs came over and said, "We'll take it from here." I wasn't paying attention to what else was going on.
MR. LALLY: So you're sort of focused on the chest compressions, and at some point some paramedic comes over and tells you they've got this?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And so after that, where did you go?
MS. ROBERTS: I stayed in the area — I think I went back over to the car.
MR. LALLY: And, um, as paramedics are working on John, um, you're over by your vehicle, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: I think so.
MR. LALLY: And so — what were you doing, and where was Miss McCabe, and where was the defendant at that?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, Karen was running around the body while the EMTs were trying to work on him. She was just frantic.
MR. LALLY: And so you're over by the car and Miss Read is running around over where Mr. O'Keefe is?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Where was Miss McCabe?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know. She was somewhere around the car, closer to me than to where Mr. O'Keefe was. I can't — I don't know.
MR. LALLY: Now where Mr. O'Keefe was, if you know, um, where was he in relation to the roadway or the paved sort of pathway of Fairview —?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know, because you couldn't tell which was the road and which was the grass — like you couldn't tell where the road began and ended. So I don't know.
MR. LALLY: Now you described the defendant sort of running around Mr. O'Keefe frantically — what if anything was she saying at that point?
MS. ROBERTS: Um — "Is he dead, is he dead, is he dead."
MR. LALLY: And that sort of phraseology — or the way to put that — was that consistent throughout how she stated it?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And again in that same sort of loud volume voice at the time?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now at some point, um, Mr. O'Keefe is taken from where he is by the paramedics to an ambulance, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And as he's being taken off the ground, what if anything did you observe in that area?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, his phone was under him, and it was grass.
MR. LALLY: Now as far as the grass that you observed, um, how was that in relation to sort of the rest of the area where Mr. O'Keefe was?
MS. ROBERTS: Everything else had snow — everything else is covered in snow.
MR. LALLY: And when he's lifted off the ground — — underneath his body, is that where the grass is?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And, um, his phone was where in relation to his body — as far as when he's lifted up, what part of his body had it been under?
MS. ROBERTS: Uh, like his — maybe his shoulder, maybe it was like his back.
MR. LALLY: So when they lifted him up it was under — like his — the right side of his back?
MS. ROBERTS: And what I'm asking is basically sort of up towards the shoulder blade or down toward the lower back? In the middle.
MR. LALLY: Um, and when you saw his phone on the grass, what if anything did you do with it?
PARENTHETICAL: [objection]
MR. LALLY: Do you know why?
MS. ROBERTS: I picked it up, I put it in my pocket, and at some point one of the First Responders asked if I had it — I handed it over.
MR. LALLY: You recall who that first responder was?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: You recall even whether it was a police officer, firefighter, or a paramedic, or no?
PARENTHETICAL: [Unclear.]
JUDGE CANNONE: All right. All right, Mr. Lally, whenever you're ready.
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: Now, as Mr. O'Keefe is being taken from where he was located when you found him to the ambulance, what happens then? What goes on from that?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, at some point Officer Goode told Karen to calm down because she was frantic. Um, and at some point they — Jen and Karen — were in the back of a police cruiser to warm up. Um, I was standing outside watching the ambulance because I could see in through the ambulance that they were moving things and working on him.
MR. LALLY: And so what if any conversation did you have with the defendant and/or Miss McCabe in reference to what you were seeing through the back of the ambulance?
MS. ROBERTS: I said they're working on him, they're working on him. And at one point Karen grabbed the front of my jacket and screamed in my face and said are they working on him, is he alive? And I said they're working on him, they're working on him, they wouldn't be working on him if he was dead. And then she had us hold hands and pray. And then at some point she had blood on her hands and she told us she had her period, so I think she was just in a state of shock, maybe.
MR. LALLY: And what if anything did either you or Miss McCabe say to her when she said that?
MS. ROBERTS: We said no, that's not your blood, that's John's.
MR. LALLY: And what happened then?
MS. ROBERTS: Then the ambulance drove away.
MR. LALLY: And if you know, about how long was it from the time that you were told by the paramedic to step away from Mr. O'Keefe — they had this — from that point to when the ambulance left?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know. I don't think it was long. I watched them work on whatever they were doing in the back of the ambulance and they got in the ambulance and drove away.
MR. LALLY: And after the ambulance left, where did the three of you go? Or where did you go, where did Miss Read go, where did Miss McCabe go?
MS. ROBERTS: Karen, I had her in my car. Jen was going up to the door to her sister's house. And the police — I said to the police — I had been on the phone. I called Mrs. O'Keefe. I had called John's mother. I had called John's father. At some point Karen was on the phone with John's sister-in-law Erin telling him — John's dad — so I grabbed the phone from her. I said he's not dead, he's in the back of an ambulance, he's been in an accident. And she said she was gonna — that Paul was going to go — John's brother — to the hospital that they were bringing John to. So I spoke to — I called Mr. O'Keefe, he didn't answer.
MR. LALLY: Next question. That'll stand. Next question. You called Mr. O'Keefe and Mrs. O'Keefe — John — correct? At some point you have a conversation with them, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And do you know why it was that Miss McCabe was going into the house on Fairview —
MS. ROBERTS: Um, to wake her sister, I think.
MR. LALLY: And after those conversations — so you grabbed the phone from the defendant and you spoke to Erin O'Keefe, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And following those conversations with members of the O'Keefe family, where is it that you were going?
MS. ROBERTS: I asked Mrs. O'Keefe if she had four-wheel drive and she said no, and Mr. O'Keefe had a van that didn't have four-wheel drive, so I said I'm going to come get you and I'll take you to the hospital.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right, so why don't we end this now.
MR. LALLY: Thank you. Good afternoon, ma'am.
MS. ROBERTS: Good afternoon.
MR. LALLY: So if I could take you back just for a moment — I apologize for this — but just for a moment, back to when you first — where Mr. O'Keefe is on the grass. Um, and at any point in time when you observed him, what if any observations did you make as far as how Mr. O'Keefe was dressed at that time?
MS. ROBERTS: Was he dressed? Yes. Um, he had jeans on. I couldn't really tell because he was covered in snow, but I know that he had — I think he had two layers on, because when the defendant lifted a shirt —
MR. LALLY: You recall if any one of those layers was like a winter jacket or any kind of heavy coat or anything like that?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: I'm sorry? No, you don't recall, or no?
MS. ROBERTS: No, it was not a coat.
MR. LALLY: Now, take you back to when you are in front of the house and Mr. O'Keefe is in the back of the ambulance, and at some point in time that ambulance leaves. Is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct.
MR. LALLY: And do you know where the ambulance was going?
MS. ROBERTS: Good Samaritan Hospital.
MR. LALLY: And following that, you mentioned that Miss McCabe went inside the house, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall what it was that caused her to go inside the house?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'll allow that. Not what anyone said.
MS. ROBERTS: Um, I think she was going to wake her sister.
MR. LALLY: And after — was there anybody else that, beyond sort of First Responders or police officers — any other sort of civilian people show up that you recall?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, Matt showed up at some point.
MR. LALLY: Matt, Jen's husband, Matt? And that was before you left, is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And just to be clear, you had — we'll get to this more in a moment — but you had left from the house once, come back, and then left again, yes?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And when her husband Matt McCabe showed up, which of those times was that?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, I think he was there when I left the first time.
MR. LALLY: And did you have any conversation with him?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, I just — he said do you want — I said I'm going to get the O'Keefes. He said do you want me to come with you? And I said no, no, no. So he went in the house.
MR. LALLY: And when you left, who if anyone — initially when you left, who if anyone left with you?
MS. ROBERTS: I left with Karen Read.
MR. LALLY: And as you're leaving in your car, you're driving, is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Where is Miss Read in the car at that point?
MS. ROBERTS: Say it again?
MR. LALLY: Where was Miss Read in your car at that point?
MS. ROBERTS: In the passenger seat.
MR. LALLY: And as you were leaving, what if anything was she doing or talking about, or what was going on when you left that first time?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, as we were leaving she was saying to me, if anything happens to John I'm going to kill myself, you need to take care of these kids.
MR. LALLY: And how did you respond?
MS. ROBERTS: He's not going to die. No one's doing anything of that nature, or something of that nature. I said yeah.
MR. LALLY: As far as you're driving away, Chapman — and you're facing towards Prest, is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And so when you left, are you following in that sort of same direction toward Cedarcrest?
MS. ROBERTS: I took a right onto Cedarcrest.
MR. LALLY: And then where did you go from there?
MS. ROBERTS: And then I got to Dam Street and I went to take a right, and then Officer Goode — Officer Goode let me go to pick up the O'Keefes, to take them. I had to give him my phone number so that he could get in touch with me if he needed to. So he did call, and he said do you have Miss Read with you? And I said yes, and he said please bring her back, her parents have called in — a suicide — they said she's saying she's suicidal.
MR. LALLY: So they wanted her to be sectioned. And so — coming back to that in a moment — but before you had left the scene, you hadn't talked to any police officers or anything at that time, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: No, other than my name and phone number, but no.
MR. LALLY: So you gave them your information and then said I have to go pick up the —
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: So you get that call from Officer Goode, and then you come back to the house, is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And during any of that time, you recall the defendant — I know you had mentioned she spoke to Erin O'Keefe — was there anybody else that the defendant spoke to or talked to while you were with her in the car?
MS. ROBERTS: She spoke to her mother. And then I ended up taking the phone and speaking to her mother, and I gave her my phone number and I said I'm going to go to the hospital. She said please make sure she does not have her purse, she has medication in her purse, I don't want her to take —
MR. LALLY: And then when you arrived back at the scene, what happened?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, she just got out of the car and walked to the ambulance.
MR. LALLY: And who — and by she, you mean the defendant?
MS. ROBERTS: I'm sorry, yes.
MR. LALLY: And who if anyone did the defendant walk with from your car to the ambulance?
MS. ROBERTS: Um, she just walked — I think she just walked by herself. I had her phone because I had been talking to her mother. So then one of the First Responders came over and said do you have her phone, and I said yes. Her mother said make sure she does not have her purse.
MR. LALLY: And then following that conversation with one of the First Responders, where did you go from there?
MS. ROBERTS: I went to go pick up the O'Keefes.
MR. LALLY: And as far as your drive from Canton, you went to where?
MS. ROBERTS: To where the O'Keefes live — Braintree.
MR. LALLY: So your drive from Canton to Braintree, and then subsequently from Braintree to Brockton — what if anything did you observe about sort of the driving conditions?
MS. ROBERTS: I was actually on the phone with Katie Camerano and I spun out, did a complete — spun a couple times on 93. near the Braintree exit, so when I got to the O'Keefes we went back roads to Brockton because I didn't want to go on the highway.
MR. LALLY: And as far as the O'Keefes in your car from Braintree to Brockton, that was both John's mother and father, correct? And at some point you get to the Good Samaritan Hospital, Brockton, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Correct. Correct.
MR. LALLY: And do you know about what time it was that you got there?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know.
MR. LALLY: When you arrived, where is it that you and the O'Keefes sort of go within the hospital?
MS. ROBERTS: Paul — John's brother Paul — had already arrived. And then we all walked in, we were in the waiting area. John's cousin actually works on the switchboard. We had been talking to her on the way in because with COVID restrictions we didn't know if we were going to be able to get in. So she had come out from the switchboard, her office, because she knew there had been an accident. So she came out to greet her family. And then I asked her to take me to the bathroom to clean up, and to the chapel.
MR. LALLY: Why was it that you had to go clean up?
MS. ROBERTS: Say it again?
MR. LALLY: Why was it that you had to go clean up?
MS. ROBERTS: Because I had blood on my hands.
MR. LALLY: Now, Ms. Roberts, you mentioned that during part of the drive from Canton to Braintree you spoke to Ms. Camerano, correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And during either that drive or the subsequent drive from Braintree to Brockton, who if anyone else did you speak to?
MS. ROBERTS: Karen called me repeatedly from the ambulance asking if I was going to come to the hospital, and she called when the O'Keefes were in the car and said she dropped him off at a party. And Mrs. O'Keefe said, "You just left him," and Mr. O'Keefe said, "Leave her alone, she's been through enough." She called a few times while we were on the ride, and then she called a lot when we were at the hospital asking if I knew anything, if he was dead — "Is he dead?" — she would hang up and then call back, hang up and then call back. And about how many times? At least 10.
MR. LALLY: And that same sort of phraseology that she was using at the scene, as far as "Is he dead," she repeated that in the phone calls at the hospital?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Now, once you arrive at the hospital and you're able to clean up a little bit, where did you go from there, what happened?
MS. ROBERTS: I went to the chapel and I said a prayer. And then I went in and talked to John's cousin, and she said that Dr. Rice was going to ask to meet with the family and that they would be told how John was doing, and that they would bring John's family back to see John. So when I came out they were being called in by Dr. Rice, and I sat in the waiting area.
MR. LALLY: And after some period of time sitting in the waiting area, what happened?
MS. ROBERTS: Mrs. O'Keefe came out and told me John was gone. And then she asked if I wanted to see him, so I did, because I figured it would be better — when I last saw him maybe he was cleaned up — but it was not. It was worse.
MR. LALLY: I'm sorry. As far as — it was worse — going into a room where John was, is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And what did you see?
MS. ROBERTS: He was in a neck brace and both eyes were huge, whereas when I found him it was only one, but they were like black, almost like filled with — I don't know — blood or fluid. They were huge.
MR. LALLY: Beyond what you observed in his eyes, what if anything else did you see on John's body?
MS. ROBERTS: He had scratches on his arm.
MR. LALLY: You recall which arm?
MS. ROBERTS: His right arm.
MR. LALLY: Where on his arm?
MS. ROBERTS: Like here. indicating
MR. LALLY: That the witness's forearm?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Following that, as far as going in to see John, what happened?
MS. ROBERTS: We came back out to the waiting area. Mrs. O'Keefe wanted to get his necklace off, but I couldn't get it, so her and Paul went back in to get the necklace off. And Karen had called me at some point from the hospital and said, "My father's going to be coming, can you just keep a lookout for him?" So when he — Mr. Read, her father — walked in, Mr. O'Keefe recognized him and said, "That's Karen's father." So I went over and I said, "Mr. Read, Mr. O'Keefe would like to speak to you," and then I just stood there. I didn't know what to do.
MR. LALLY: And at some point did you leave from the hospital?
MS. ROBERTS: I did. I took Mr. O'Keefe in my car and Paul took Mrs. O'Keefe in his.
MR. LALLY: And where did the — where did the two vehicles —
MS. ROBERTS: I dropped Mr. O'Keefe off at John's house and then I went home.
MR. LALLY: And without getting into too much detail, as far as the road conditions that you described earlier, how were they?
MS. ROBERTS: It was absolutely horrible. I told Mr. O'Keefe, "If you see a front door in your vision we are about to hit a house, because I can't see where we're going," and my windshield wiper broke.
MR. LALLY: Now, you dropped Mr. O'Keefe off at John's house on Meadow Street, is that right?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And Read's vehicle, was that still there at that point?
MS. ROBERTS: I think so. I don't recall, but I think so.
MR. LALLY: And then you went home, is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: Later on that day or that afternoon, did anyone come to your house to speak to you in regard to what happened?
MS. ROBERTS: There were two officers, but I don't remember their names.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall which department they were from?
MS. ROBERTS: The State Police.
MR. LALLY: As far as the officers that came to your house and spoke to you, you don't recall their names, is that correct?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't.
MR. LALLY: Do you recall if either one of them was Trooper Proctor?
MS. ROBERTS: It was not.
MR. LALLY: And where in your house did you speak to them?
MS. ROBERTS: In the dining room.
MR. LALLY: And did they speak to anybody else at your house at that time?
MS. ROBERTS: My husband.
MR. LALLY: And as far as when they spoke to you and they spoke to your husband — starting with yourself — do you know where your husband was when the troopers were speaking to you?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know where he was, but he wasn't in the room with me.
MR. LALLY: And as far as when the troopers were speaking with your husband, where were you?
MS. ROBERTS: I was not in the room.
MR. LALLY: Following that, did you have occasion to speak to any other troopers or members of the State Police at any point in time afterward?
MS. ROBERTS: I've only spoken to Michael Proctor one time. It was from Jen's house.
MR. LALLY: And when was that, if you know?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know, maybe a couple days later, because Jen and I were going over whatever had happened. Mrs. O'Keefe had advised us to make a timeline because she said, "This could be a while, you guys aren't going to remember something years from now, so sit down, write down what you remember." And at that point I said, "When she first called, she said he was dead," and Jen said, "I don't think you've told them that." So Michael Proctor called — or she was on the phone with him, I don't even know — and I said, "Could I speak to him?" So I told him, so that somebody had it documented.
MR. LALLY: So as far as Proctor was concerned, that phone conversation — is that the only contact that you have had with Proctor?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And if you recall, was it February 1st or so that you met with some troopers at McCabe's house? At some point did you meet with troopers at McCabe's house?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And if you know, was that on or around a couple days later, like February 1st or so?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't — yeah, maybe. I don't know, I can't be sure.
MR. LALLY: Were either of those troopers that you met at McCabe's house Proctor?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall where within McCabe's house you spoke to them?
MS. ROBERTS: In the living room.
MR. LALLY: And beyond yourself and the troopers that you spoke to, was there anybody else in the room with you when you talked?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: At some point, either then or subsequent to then, was there any request made by any trooper from the State Police in regard to your cell phone?
MS. ROBERTS: To my cell phone?
MR. LALLY: Yes.
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall if it was that date or a later date?
MS. ROBERTS: It was not that day. I think it was the next day — it was within the next two days. They wanted to clone my phone.
MR. LALLY: And did they advise you of anything or give you any form that you had to fill out and execute prior to doing that?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes, I had to fill out a form.
MR. LALLY: And as far as your phone was concerned, were there any restrictions or anything that you gave to them as far as what they could look at, or what they could clone, or what they could do with your phone?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And as far as how that process works, as far as the cell phone extraction or anything, do you know anything about that?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And do you recall how long it was that you were without your phone, from the time you handed it over to them to whenever you got it back?
MS. ROBERTS: Well, they took both of our phones at the same time, and we didn't get them back for like seven or eight hours.
MR. LALLY: And just to be clear, when you say "both of our phones," whose phone and your phone?
MS. ROBERTS: Jen's phone and my phone.
MR. LALLY: Now, at some point, or at any point, did you give any kind of interview or have any conversation with any officer from the Canton Police in regard to what happened that day?
MS. ROBERTS: No.
MR. LALLY: And are you familiar with a Canton officer named Michael Lank?
MS. ROBERTS: Yes.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sorry, one moment.
MR. LALLY: How do you know him?
MS. ROBERTS: My daughter and his daughter are friends.
MR. LALLY: So beyond your daughters being friends, is that someone that you know or that you socialize with or anything like that?
MS. ROBERTS: No. I mean, they've come over to my house — his wife and him — one time, but we don't hang out with them socially. His wife and I are friends.
MR. LALLY: Now, at some point around this date, around January 29, let me ask you Turning to the next day of January 30th, do you recall what you did that day?
MS. ROBERTS: We went over to the O'Keefes' house — my daughter, Jen, and Jen's daughter, and myself.
MR. LALLY: And following that, where did you go?
MS. ROBERTS: My daughter wanted to get dropped off to her friend's house at Mike Lank's.
MR. LALLY: And so after leaving the O'Keefes' house, is it still the same as far as yourself, your daughter, Miss McCabe, and her daughter?
MS. ROBERTS: Her daughter stayed at the O'Keefes. And as far as Mr. Lank was concerned — after dropping your daughter off, did you go anywhere with Jen?
MR. LALLY: After that?
MS. ROBERTS: I just stopped at Mike Lank's house, I think, and then we went home.
MR. LALLY: And so when you got to your daughter's friend's house, did you speak with anyone?
MS. ROBERTS: Mike's wife came out to the car to see how I was and how the O'Keefes were, and so she talked to us for a bit, just asking how everyone was.
MR. LALLY: And if you know, ma'am, do you know about how long that conversation was?
MS. ROBERTS: I mean, I'm a talker, so it's probably a while. I'd say at least 45 minutes.
MR. LALLY: Was that a conversation through the window, or did she get in the car?
MS. ROBERTS: I think she got in the car — she was in the back seat because it was freezing.
MR. LALLY: From that conversation, do you recall anything beyond sort of how people were doing? Did you discuss anything about sort of what you had seen or what you had heard the day before, on the 29th?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't recall. It was just a regular conversation — well, not regular, obviously — but she was more concerned with how the O'Keefes were doing, how the kids were doing.
MR. LALLY: And then after you left from the Lank's house, where did you go — where did you and Miss McCabe go?
MS. ROBERTS: I don't know. I'm assuming home.
MR. LALLY: One moment. Your Honor, may I approach?
PARENTHETICAL: [Sidebar]
MR. LALLY: I have no further questions for this witness.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay. Miss Little?
MS. LITTLE: No questions.