Commonwealth v. Read — Trial ArchiveJason Becker - Direct/Cross/Redirect/Recross
481 linesMR. BRENNAN: The Commonwealth calls Jason Becker.
COURT CLERK: Do you swear that the testimony you shall give to the court and the jury in the matter now pending shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
MR. BECKER: I do.
MR. BRENNAN: Thank you, your honor. Good afternoon, sir.
MR. BECKER: Good afternoon.
MR. BRENNAN: Could you please introduce yourself to the jury?
MR. BECKER: My name is Jason Becker.
MR. BRENNAN: How old are you?
MR. BECKER: I am 36 years old.
MR. BRENNAN: Do you live in the area?
MR. BECKER: I do. I live in Canton.
MR. BRENNAN: Tell us a little bit about your education.
MR. BECKER: My education — high school, and college at UMass, and I went to EMT school a little over 10 years ago, and paramedic school.
MR. BRENNAN: Tell me a little bit about EMT school. How old were you when you started EMT school?
MR. BECKER: When I started EMT school, roughly 21 years old.
MR. BRENNAN: Why did you decide to go to EMT school?
MR. BECKER: I wanted to save some lives.
MR. BRENNAN: Tell us a little bit about EMT school. What did it require?
MR. BECKER: EMT school was a couple months of classroom work, and then you do some ride time on the ambulance. Paramedic school is a little different — it's about two years' worth of training. You're doing hospital ER time and ambulance time also.
MR. BRENNAN: How long did you serve as an EMT before you went to paramedic school?
MR. BECKER: I worked as an EMT for approximately 5 years.
MR. BRENNAN: Can you estimate how many dozens or hundreds of calls you were on during that time?
MR. BECKER: Hundreds.
MR. BRENNAN: Why did you decide then to go get paramedic training?
MR. BECKER: Oh, I wanted to be on the fire department and it was a prerequisite.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you complete paramedic school successfully?
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. BRENNAN: Were you still working as an EMT at the time?
MR. BECKER: I was.
MR. BRENNAN: And inevitably, did you seek to have a different job? Did you try to be a firefighter?
MR. BECKER: I wanted to be a firefighter. Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: Were you successful in doing that?
MR. BECKER: I was.
MR. BRENNAN: Tell us a little bit about that, sir.
MR. BECKER: I got on the Canton Fire Department, and they sent me to the fire academy where you train to be a firefighter.
MR. BRENNAN: So you had EMT training, paramedic training, and then firefighter training.
MR. BECKER: That's correct.
MR. BRENNAN: On the Canton Police Department, did you serve dual roles as a paramedic and as a firefighter?
MR. BECKER: Uh, fire department?
MR. BRENNAN: Yes. Yes, sir.
MR. BECKER: Yes, sir — firefighter and paramedic.
MR. BRENNAN: You served as a firefighter and a paramedic?
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: And the Canton Fire Department, does it have more than one station?
MR. BECKER: There are two.
MR. BRENNAN: Is there one station that's larger or smaller than the other?
MR. BECKER: Station 1 is the headquarters, which is larger.
MR. BRENNAN: Had you ever spent time at Station 1 as a firefighter or a paramedic?
MR. BECKER: I have. We rotate through both stations.
MR. BRENNAN: I want you to take us back to January 29th, 2022. Were you working that evening?
MR. BECKER: I was.
MR. BRENNAN: What station were you assigned to?
MR. BECKER: Canton Station 2.
MR. BRENNAN: Canton Fire Station 2.
MR. BECKER: Correct. And that's the smaller of the two stations.
MR. BRENNAN: It is. Were you working with anybody at Fire Station 2 that night?
MR. BECKER: My ambulance partner at the time was firefighter Dan Whitley.
MR. BRENNAN: Was there anybody else who was working at Fire Station 2 in addition to you and Dan Whitley?
MR. BECKER: Correct. There was an engine company with three guys on it.
MR. BRENNAN: Three people were assigned to the engine.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: Were you and Dan Whitley assigned as partners for the day, the week?
MR. BECKER: Correct. Yes, we were.
MR. BRENNAN: Which was it, the day or the week, sir?
MR. BECKER: The week.
MR. BRENNAN: So for the entire week, you were partners with Dan Whitley. And does that rotate on other assignments?
MR. BECKER: It does. It rotates.
MR. BRENNAN: So on this particular week, you were assigned as partners with Dan Whitley.
MR. BECKER: I was.
MR. BRENNAN: What were your roles between the two of you?
MR. BECKER: Well, at the time, he was my preceptor. I was a new paramedic at the time, so I was more or less the lead tech on all the calls as part of my training. And Dan's been a paramedic for a long time, so he was there to teach me.
MR. BRENNAN: So, would Dan Whitley be the lead on the call and he would help you?
MR. BECKER: I would be the lead. Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you get a call that early morning hours of January 29th, 2022?
MR. BECKER: We did.
MR. BRENNAN: What was the call assigned for?
MR. BECKER: It was a call for a section 12 psych eval.
MR. BRENNAN: Very briefly, can you tell us what a section 12 is?
MR. BECKER: Sure. It's a transportation order filled out by police, doctor, basically for us on the ambulance, that we have to take the patient whether voluntarily or involuntarily because they're a threat to themselves or someone else.
MR. BRENNAN: When you received the call for section 12, were you aware that there were other calls that fire station one had responded to that morning?
MR. BECKER: We were aware. You can hear the calls going out each station.
MR. BRENNAN: Were you or Dan Whitley any part of that earlier call that fire station one responded to before you got the call for the section 12?
MR. BECKER: We were not.
MR. BRENNAN: So your efforts were after—
MR. BECKER: We were after. Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: After you got the call to respond to a section 12, did you head towards Fairview Road?
MR. BECKER: We did.
MR. BRENNAN: Tell us a little bit about the trip to Fairview Road.
MR. BECKER: It was a little extended because of the weather conditions at the time. Snowing heavily, windy, low visibility.
MR. BRENNAN: Okay. How long did it take to get from Fire Station 2 to Fairview Road?
MR. BECKER: Approximately 8 to 10 minutes.
MR. BRENNAN: Who drove?
MR. BECKER: Firefighter Whitley.
MR. BRENNAN: Now, on the way to Fairview Road, do you sit in the front of the ambulance?
MR. BECKER: We do.
MR. BRENNAN: Take us to when you arrive at Fairview Road, what do you see?
MR. BECKER: You see a bunch of police lights. Canton Engine 3 was already on scene, so we parked behind them.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you have a— without talking about what you spoke about, did you have a chance to speak to anybody at the scene?
MR. BECKER: We briefly spoke to the Canton police and they briefed us and sent us to where the defendant was at the time.
MR. BRENNAN: Why do you have a conversation with other first responders at the scene before you do anything?
MR. BECKER: Just, you know, they're making sure the scene is safe to begin with and they're on scene first, so they have a little more info than what our dispatch would have.
MR. BRENNAN: After you had that debriefing with colleagues, were you directed to approach any certain person?
MR. BECKER: I was.
MR. BRENNAN: Where did you go?
MR. BECKER: I went to the defendant who was sitting in a black SUV type car.
MR. BRENNAN: Were there other persons inside the car with the defendant?
MR. BECKER: From my understanding, it was one person in the driver's seat.
MR. BRENNAN: And what seat was the defendant in?
MR. BECKER: She was in the front passenger seat.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you have a chance to speak to her?
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. BRENNAN: And the person you spoke to who was in the passenger seat of that car, do you see that person in court today?
MR. BECKER: I do.
MR. BRENNAN: Could you point out and describe an article of clothing, please?
MR. BECKER: Miss Read, right there, she's in the blue, maybe navy blue.
MR. BRENNAN: How long was your conversation with the defendant while she was still seated inside the vehicle?
MR. BECKER: Probably 5 to 8 minutes.
MR. BRENNAN: At some point, did you and the defendant move to another location?
MR. BECKER: We did.
MR. BRENNAN: Where did you go?
MR. BECKER: So we went back to the ambulance.
MR. BRENNAN: After having a conversation with her, was she cooperative going back to the ambulance with you?
MR. BECKER: She was.
MR. BRENNAN: And did you ask her to be seated in the ambulance?
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. BRENNAN: She cooperative with that as well?
MR. BECKER: She was.
MR. BRENNAN: After she was seated in the ambulance, did you close the doors and get in?
MR. BECKER: We did.
MR. BRENNAN: When you say we, who was with you?
MR. BECKER: Me and firefighter Whitley.
MR. BRENNAN: So you and firefighter Whitley were in the back of the ambulance with Miss Read. Who was going to drive the ambulance?
MR. BECKER: Firefighter Sam Pac.
MR. BRENNAN: Where did he come from?
MR. BECKER: He was on the fire engine that was already on scene.
MR. BRENNAN: I want to ask you questions now about what you did in the back of the ambulance and some of the conversations that you had. Tell us what your role is once you have a patient in the back of the ambulance. What do you do next?
MR. BECKER: I mean, each patient's different. Depends on what the call is for. In this specific situation, it was more a psych eval, because that's what we were called for. Initial triage questions: is the patient cooperative, uncooperative, combative? I asked her name, her mental status, where she was. I asked if she was suicidal, and if she was, did she have a plan, did she want to hurt anyone else? Those are kind of initial triage questions that I would ask.
MR. BRENNAN: Why do you ask those questions?
MR. BECKER: Just to get a kind of judgment on the patient, reading the patient.
MR. BRENNAN: What's your role at that point? Are you an investigator?
MR. BECKER: I'm not.
MR. BRENNAN: Are you in any way law enforcement?
MR. BECKER: I'm not.
MR. BRENNAN: So, what's your focus when you're speaking to a patient?
MR. BECKER: It's basically hearing them speak, hearing their story. In this specific situation, we didn't know the circumstances. We just knew that Miss Read had found her husband, whom she was calling dead on the side of the road. So it was a traumatic call.
MR. BRENNAN: So, when you were there, you knew nothing about what had happened before you got there?
MR. BECKER: We did not.
MR. BRENNAN: And your role had nothing to do with any of that investigation?
MR. BECKER: We did not.
MR. BRENNAN: You were solely focused on caring for the patient, correct? Did you have any other role other than caring for the patient?
MR. BECKER: Just making sure she got to the hospital safely, she didn't hurt herself.
MR. BRENNAN: During those conversations, are you and firefighter Whitley doing the same thing or different things?
MR. BECKER: Again, it depends on the call. I was lead tech, so I'm the one documenting, giving report to the nurses, the staff. So I was more kind of getting that information, my initial triage questions. And then just kind of sat and supported Miss Read.
MR. BRENNAN: Were you writing down information, technical information about status and health on a report?
MR. BECKER: I was. Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: While you were doing that, was your colleague speaking to Miss Read?
MR. BECKER: He was.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you have a chance at times to hear what they were speaking about?
MR. BECKER: Yeah. In and out.
MR. BRENNAN: At other times, did you speak directly to Miss Read?
MR. BECKER: I have.
MR. BRENNAN: Can you describe her demeanor, her temperament?
MR. BECKER: Initially she was agitated because she didn't feel like she needed to go to the hospital. She said the statement she made, she didn't mean, she just kind of said in jest because of the events that she went through. But then there'd be periods where she'd be calm and then it would fluctuate. She would have pressured speech, repetitive, but all in all she was cooperative.
MR. BRENNAN: At some point, did you have a chance to speak to her directly about her mood?
MR. BECKER: About her mood?
MR. BRENNAN: About her mood.
MR. BECKER: I don't know if I understand the question.
MR. BRENNAN: Okay. Did she say anything to you about her last interaction with what she referred to as her husband?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. BRENNAN: Did she make any statements to you when you were giving her treatment or speaking to her about her husband?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'll allow that. It came in.
MR. BECKER: One of the reasons why she was saying that stuff is because the last thing—the last conversation she had with her husband at the time was an argument. I didn't feel like it was my role to really find out the details on what was said. But that's what she said to me. That the last thing she said to him was an argument.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. BRENNAN: Did she tell you what the argument was about?
MR. BECKER: She did not.
MR. BRENNAN: Inevitably, did you get a chance to bring her to the hospital?
MR. BECKER: We did.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you stay in the back of the ambulance with her?
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you continue to have conversations with her?
MR. BECKER: Yes, I did.
MR. BRENNAN: Did you hear conversations or parts of conversations she was having with your colleague?
MR. BECKER: I had parts.
MR. BRENNAN: When you got to the hospital, what happens next?
MR. BECKER: So we brought Miss Read into the hospital. Registered her, brought her to the psychiatric section.
MR. BRENNAN: Is it— Thank you. I have no further questions.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay, Mr. Jackson.
MR. JACKSON: Thank you. I have just [unintelligible].
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Good afternoon, firefighter Becker.
MR. BECKER: Good afternoon.
MR. JACKSON: When you first arrived at the scene, there were at least two Canton police officers there still, correct?
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Do you remember their names?
MR. BECKER: Officer Saraf and Officer Mullaney.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Their cruiser was there. You said that an engine was still there. Correct. And was there another ambulance there or the other ambulance had already left the scene?
MR. BECKER: They'd cleared? They had already transported to the hospital.
MR. JACKSON: Remind me, you were in Ambulance 2.
MR. BECKER: I was Ambulance 2.
MR. JACKSON: Got it. You parked behind the SUV where you ultimately made contact with Miss Read. Correct?
MR. BECKER: Correct. I think it was more in front of the SUV because of the way the SUV was parked.
MR. JACKSON: Got it. Got out of the ambulance, ultimately made contact with Miss Read through the passenger door.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Had a short conversation with her there.
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. JACKSON: You said it was maybe 5 to 8 minutes.
MR. BECKER: Well, 5 minutes because of the weather conditions.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Nothing of great consequence. I'm guessing just an initial— I think you called it sort of a triage assessment.
MR. BECKER: Well, more of just introducing myself and asking her how she was doing.
MR. JACKSON: Got it. And then there was one other person in the cab of the vehicle as well.
MR. BECKER: There was.
MR. JACKSON: Female?
MR. BECKER: Female.
MR. JACKSON: So there were two females—one Miss Read, one another female. Did you see any other civilian females out there?
MR. BECKER: I didn't.
MR. JACKSON: I didn't see. Okay. So at least where you were, the contact that you had with Miss Read and this other female, there was just two of them, not a third one.
MR. BECKER: From what I saw. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Did you get the other female's name?
MR. BECKER: I at the time I did not.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Have you — by the way, have you since gotten her name?
MR. BECKER: Um, based on a conversation firefighter Whitley and Miss Read had in the back of the ambulance.
MR. JACKSON: Got it. Okay. And who was that other person?
MR. BECKER: Uh, Miss Kerry Roberts.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. When you first observed Miss Read, did you note whether or not there was anything unusual about her physical appearance, meaning anything on her?
MR. BECKER: Uh, yes.
MR. JACKSON: Describe that for the jurors, please.
MR. BECKER: So she had some blood around her mouth, um, her neck area.
MR. JACKSON: At that point, were you concerned about — obviously you're concerned mainly about her safety and getting her safely to the hospital?
MR. BECKER: That's correct.
MR. JACKSON: Were you worried that that might be her blood?
MR. BECKER: Well, she had said that she had given CPR to her husband.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. You jumped a question ahead. I was going to say, did she tell you that it was in fact not her blood?
MR. BECKER: She did.
MR. JACKSON: So that kind of in a way ruled it out — no injury for me. And you didn't notice anything about her that looked like she was physically injured, physically in harm?
MR. BECKER: Yeah, I did not.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. She indicated that she had given CPR, mouth-to-mouth — attempts at mouth-to-mouth resuscitation — to Mr. O'Keefe.
MR. BECKER: Correct. She did.
MR. JACKSON: And that would account for the blood on her face and in her hair and on her neck.
MR. BECKER: That's what she told me.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. And based on your observations of her, you didn't have any reason to quarrel with that.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. You indicated that her tone was somewhat rapid and repetitive. Is that right?
MR. BECKER: Uh, it fluctuated. So at times it was. Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Did it appear to you at that time that she had gone through a pretty significant trauma as best you were trained at the time?
MR. BRENNAN: Objection. A little bit more of a foundation.
MR. JACKSON: I'll give it to you. Sure. Have you ever in your course of training seen individuals who have gone through some sort of a traumatic event?
MR. BECKER: Frequently.
MR. JACKSON: Frequently. Everyone's different though.
MR. BECKER: Understood.
MR. JACKSON: Obviously, everybody's got their own personalities and the way of dealing with those things, right?
MR. BECKER: Sure.
MR. JACKSON: Have you been able to through your training assess whether — at least in your belief, your observations — if someone has gone through a relatively traumatic event as opposed to just someone whistling down the sidewalk?
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Did it appear at that time, when you're interacting with Miss Read, that she was showing signs consistent with having gone through a trauma at the time?
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. So hence the rapid speech, the repetitive speech, things of that nature.
MR. BECKER: Correct. For her — for the defendant — you know, some people don't — you know —
MR. JACKSON: Understood. I'm just talking about your observations of her at that time.
MR. BECKER: Yes. Yes, sir. Her demeanor was consistent with having gone through a significant trauma for the situation.
MR. JACKSON: Sure. Yes. Okay. You said that she went from calmness to agitation. The agitation you accounted for being — I don't necessarily want to go to the hospital. I don't want to be sectioned.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: She felt like she didn't — you know — she didn't need to. It wasn't — she wasn't going to act on her comments about wanting to harm herself. You called it, I think, in a report — it's SI, suicidal ideation.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: That's obviously of great concern to you and your partners when you're assessing a patient.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: That's right. You don't want to leave someone on their own if they're going to self harm.
MR. BECKER: Correct. That's correct.
MR. JACKSON: You pretty quickly assessed, I'm guessing, firefighter Becker, that she was not in fact in the position to self harm. That — I think you said that the statements she originally made — if John dies, I don't want to live — were not necessarily at the level of actual suicidal ideation. Is that right?
MR. BECKER: Yeah. At the time, I believed her because of — you know — the information we got and what she went through.
MR. JACKSON: I'm sorry, I didn't quite understand your answer.
MR. BECKER: Sorry, can you repeat your question?
MR. JACKSON: It's probably my fault. Um, at the time that you assessed her, even though she had made some comments about "if John doesn't live, I don't want to live either," you did not elevate that to the level of her being suicidal at that moment.
MR. BECKER: So I couldn't rule it out, but — you know — I didn't think it was a huge threat at the time.
MR. JACKSON: Understood. Couldn't rule it out, so that's why — you know — we had to take her to the hospital.
MR. BECKER: Understood.
MR. JACKSON: I mean, you had a section 12. You had to take her irrespective of what you ruled in or out, right?
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Firefighter Whitley was with you in the back of the ambulance the entire time you were with Miss Read.
MR. BECKER: Correct. Not the entire time. He was — before we started transporting — he was kind of in and out, trying to find more — you know — talking to the police officers, find more of a story of — you know — what happened, why we're taking the defendant on a section 12.
MR. JACKSON: Once you and Miss Read were in the back of the ambulance, firefighter Whitley then joined you in the back of the ambulance.
MR. BECKER: He did.
MR. JACKSON: How much time elapsed?
MR. BECKER: Oh, it was a couple minutes at the most.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. So it wasn't a lengthy amount of time.
MR. BECKER: It wasn't lengthy.
MR. JACKSON: And he was with you during the transport along with Miss Read for the whole transport back to Good Sam.
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: And on direct examination — I think your phrase was — all in all, she was cooperative with us for the majority of the transport.
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Never became combative, ever got physical, nothing like that?
MR. BECKER: No.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. She did refer to Mr. O'Keefe as her husband or her spouse.
MR. BECKER: That's correct.
MR. JACKSON: You're aware of HIPAA rules. Obviously, you're in the medical field, correct?
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: You were aware at the time that HIPAA rules would demand or dictate that unless you're a spouse or a parent or a child, there are certain rules against getting or providing information to someone who isn't one of those close family members.
MR. BECKER: Correct. That's correct.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. You previously indicated on direct examination that — I think your words were — that Miss Read indicated that her last conversation she had with her husband was an argument.
MR. BECKER: Correct. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: You've previously testified about that statement in other particulars, right? Other hearings.
MR. BECKER: I have.
MR. JACKSON: You're paraphrasing. You didn't write down what she said about her previous interactions with Mr. O'Keefe and you didn't record those on a tape recorder.
MR. BECKER: Correct. I wrote down in my report that she said she had an argument.
MR. JACKSON: Right. You didn't write them down at the time. That was a bad question on my part. You weren't taking notes as she was speaking.
MR. BECKER: I could have been. I mean, it's kind of — for every call we jot down notes on a notepad, just so when we give the staff a report we can read off it.
MR. JACKSON: Do you have those notes?
MR. BECKER: I don't.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Do you think you took notes or no?
MR. BECKER: To be honest, I'm not sure. I could have been typing them on the computer. That's what we type the report on.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. At the time. Do you have an independent recollection of taking notes either handwritten or on a computer as you sit here right now?
MR. BECKER: I couldn't tell you if I did one or the other. Sometimes I write on the computer, sometimes I don't.
MR. JACKSON: Or you might not have written anything down.
MR. BECKER: Correct. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. So in any event, you weren't taking down — even if you were taking notes — you weren't taking down verbatim quotes of what she was saying. You were paraphrasing the information that was coming to you.
MR. BECKER: Correct. That's correct.
MR. JACKSON: All right. You had previously indicated, in recounting what it was that Miss Read actually said to you, something along the lines of she was upset because her last words to him were — because of her last words to him being in anger.
MR. BRENNAN: I object.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'm going to allow the question.
MR. JACKSON: Is that correct?
MR. BECKER: Well, I probably phrased it a little wrongly. The last words — it was the last conversation. She —
MR. JACKSON: Okay, that wasn't my question. My question is a simple one. In a previous hearing, did you use the phrase "her last words to him"?
MR. BECKER: Yes. I did.
MR. JACKSON: And that was at a hearing where you were under oath just like you are now.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: That was a little closer in time than we are now. Was maybe a year ago.
MR. BECKER: Correct. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Actually, my mistake. It was about two and a half years ago. It was a grand jury.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Grand jury.
MR. BECKER: Uh, yes.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. And the phrase that you used — and I want to concentrate on that for just a quick second, firefighter Becker — the phrase that you used at that time was that she said, quote, like her last words to him. She was upset about her quote last words to him. Is that right?
MR. BRENNAN: I object.
JUDGE CANNONE: All right. Can I see counsel at sidebar, please?
MR. JACKSON: May I continue, your honor?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Thank you. When you were recounting the conversation that Miss Read indicated that she was upset about, you also indicated — in addition to using the phrase "her last words to him" — you also said that it was earlier in the night.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. JACKSON: They had an argument earlier in the night.
MR. BECKER: I don't recall.
MR. JACKSON: May I have just a moment, your honor?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: May I approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Thank you. If you don't mind, uh, take a look at the top paragraph. Very, very small print. Let me know when you've refreshed your recollection.
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Great. May I approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Thank you, sir. When you wrote your report, you had indicated that when she was describing the argument that you testified to on direct, uh, it was about an argument that was quote earlier in the night.
MR. BECKER: Earlier in the night. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. And then you recounted that statement, that same statement in the grand jury later on as at least including quote her last words. Is that right?
MR. BECKER: Her last words.
MR. JACKSON: You were talking about an argument that they had and then she was upset and you were paraphrasing her and one of the things that you paraphrased was in fact — your statement was she was upset that that was like her last words to him.
MR. BECKER: Correct. She said that. Yes. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Were you also made aware? Did she tell you that her last words to him were in voicemails? Did she say that?
MR. BECKER: She didn't give any details.
MR. JACKSON: Did you ask her what were your last words to him?
MR. BECKER: I did not.
MR. JACKSON: Did she ever say whether or not she believed he ever received her last words to him?
MR. BECKER: There's no — no other details than — there was no other details other than what she said.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. Um, but she did — when she was having this conversation with you about her last words to him, she did actually take out her phone and show you a bunch of missed calls to him at the same time. Didn't she?
MR. BECKER: She tried to. Yes.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. In your mind, did you put two and two together that what she was actually talking about were the missed calls and her being upset about her last words to him being very angry on those missed calls, those voicemails. Did you put those two things together?
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. JACKSON: Thank you. That's all I have.
JUDGE CANNONE: Okay. Mr. Brennan.
MR. BRENNAN: Sir, when Miss Read told you that she was sad because her last conversation or her last thing that she had said to him was an argument, did she ever suggest that was in a voicemail?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'll allow it.
MR. BRENNAN: Did she ever suggest it was in a voicemail?
MR. BECKER: She did not.
MR. BRENNAN: Did she ever suggest that she didn't actually speak to him, but instead it was some type of message?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Overruled.
MR. BRENNAN: Did she ever suggest that?
MR. BECKER: She did not.
MR. BRENNAN: In fact, um, you wrote a report saying that there was an argument earlier in the night, didn't you?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained.
MR. BRENNAN: You then, uh, were interviewed, weren't you? Were you interviewed on February 14th, 2022?
MR. BECKER: Um, yes.
MR. BRENNAN: And you referred to the fact that she told you there was an argument earlier in the night.
MR. BECKER: Argument early in the night. Okay.
MR. BRENNAN: And she was telling you this when you were speaking to her that morning, correct?
MR. BECKER: Um, around 6:00 a.m. Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: And earlier in the night, do you know if she was referring to 12:30?
MR. BECKER: I did not know.
MR. BRENNAN: Or 12:15?
MR. BECKER: No.
MR. BRENNAN: Or midnight?
MR. BECKER: I didn't know the time.
JUDGE CANNONE: So his answer is he doesn't know.
MR. BRENNAN: You testified in the grand jury and Attorney Jackson just asked you some questions about part of the statement you made to the grand jury when he said like her last words. Um, would you like to put that in context of the whole statement you made? Do you remember the entire statement that you made in the grand jury about the statement that was made to you?
MR. BECKER: I'd have to.
MR. BRENNAN: May I approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: This is page 81 lines 1 through 4. Please read it to yourself.
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: Very good. Now, when you made that statement you were asked about in the grand jury, you didn't just say like her last words, did you?
MR. BECKER: No. No.
MR. BRENNAN: Um, you explained your memory to the grand jury.
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: Ask him what you told the grand jury.
MR. BRENNAN: Okay. The grand jury, do you know it was on April 21st, 2022?
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: Okay. And did you tell the grand jury — so she — she —
JUDGE CANNONE: I'm going to see counsel at sidebar for a second.
PARENTHETICAL: [Sidebar]
MR. BRENNAN: May I approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: So, I'm showing you that statement that you made that includes last words, but there's more to the statement. Isn't that —
MR. BECKER: She — she was upset.
MR. BRENNAN: I'd like you to read the entire —
MR. BECKER: Sure.
MR. BRENNAN: Read that out loud.
MR. BECKER: Uh, so she — she was also um — she was upset also because she said they had, you know, the last time they had talked she had gotten into an argument. So she was upset that that was like her last words to him.
MR. BRENNAN: And so when you were speaking about her last words to him, were you referring to the argument?
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: You testified again regarding this issue, didn't you, on May 3rd, 2024?
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: And at that point, did you think or believe that the conversation she was relating to you was about a voicemail?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'm going to sustain the objection.
MR. BRENNAN: Um, did you use the word argument again on May 3rd, 2024?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'm going to allow this.
MR. BECKER: I used argument.
MR. BRENNAN: May I approach, your honor?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: Can I ask you to read your prior statement on page 10 lines 9 through 13?
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'm going to see you at sidebar again. Bring these documents. Please bring all of it.
MR. BRENNAN: May I?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: Thank you. Sir, when you wrote the report of your notes to put in your report, um, do you remember the word argument?
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. BRENNAN: Do you remember her actually saying the word argument?
MR. BECKER: I did.
MR. BRENNAN: Do you remember her ever saying any word about voice messages?
MR. BECKER: I did not.
MR. BRENNAN: You said that there was somebody in the front seat of the car with the defendant.
MR. BECKER: There was.
MR. BRENNAN: And you later learned from the defendant it was a person by the name of Kerry Roberts.
MR. BECKER: Correct.
MR. BRENNAN: Can you share with us the context? How did you learn that?
MR. BECKER: Um, the defendant and uh my partner, firefighter Whitley, had a conversation.
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'm going to allow it.
MR. BECKER: She — she um, the defendant brought up how if her husband had died at the time, she didn't know how she was going to take care of his kids.
MR. JACKSON: Objection.
JUDGE CANNONE: I'm going to allow this.
MR. BECKER: And um firefighter Whitley mentioned that she had um like a strong support system. You know, all the friends are in Canton.
MR. BRENNAN: May we approach?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes.
MR. BRENNAN: When you spoke to the defendant and she shared with you that her last words with uh her husband were an argument — why didn't you ask for more detail about that?
MR. BECKER: I didn't feel it was — you know, at the time we went about the call — we didn't, you know, think we would be witnesses in a murder trial. Um, you know, we were there to support Karen and ultimately get to the hospital safely.
MR. BRENNAN: And you were asked about trauma and you said that you observed that the person may be in trauma. Miss Read, uh — a traumatic event — a traumatic event, right? Do you have any idea what caused that traumatic event?
MR. BECKER: I did not.
MR. BRENNAN: Thank you. I have no further questions.
JUDGE CANNONE: Anything?
MR. JACKSON: Very briefly. You indicated that you were asked on redirect examination by Mr. Brennan whether earlier in the night could have been 12 or 12:15 a.m. Correct. That's what he asked.
MR. BECKER: Yes.
MR. JACKSON: And earlier in the night could have been 6:00 p.m.
MR. BECKER: Earlier in the night. Yeah. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: Could have been 5:00 p.m. Could have been — could have been 7:00 p.m.
MR. BECKER: Sure.
MR. JACKSON: Okay. You were also asked whether or not Miss Read actually specifically mentioned voicemails when she talked about those last words, and you said she didn't.
MR. BECKER: That I remember. Correct.
MR. JACKSON: But she did show you her phone.
MR. BECKER: She tried to.
MR. JACKSON: And she did show you a bunch of missed calls to John O'Keefe. Correct?
MR. BECKER: I wasn't going to look through her phone. I don't know who she called.
MR. JACKSON: Thank you. That's when she said about the argument, she said those were the last words, the argument. Right.
MR. BECKER: That's correct.
JUDGE CANNONE: Sustained. All right. Jurors disregard that last statement. All right. You are all set. Thank you.
MR. BECKER: Thank you.
JUDGE CANNONE: Is this a good place to stop for the day,
MR. BRENNAN: If the court pleases?
JUDGE CANNONE: Yes. We could do six minutes, but um, I think we'll just — this is probably a good place to stop. All right. So, as I understand it, folks, we're on schedule right where we thought we would be. We're going to release you for today. Now, when I told you this morning, and I've told you other times, too, that when you're out in that room waiting for us, we're in here getting work done to make things more efficient for the trial, especially a trial this long. We've decided that we're going to spend Monday afternoon again trying to streamline this trial and deal with issues that we have to deal with. So, Monday for you will be a half day. All right? So, I just wanted to tell you that before you left today. Please, again, those three cautions. Do not discuss this case with anyone.
JUDGE CANNONE: Don't do any independent research or investigation into this case. If you happen to see, hear, or read anything about this case, uh, please disregard it. Let us know. And I guess the fourth caution is the same as I've been saying. Please be very careful with your social media. All right. Have a good weekend. We'll see you Monday morning. All right. [unintelligible — court officer instruction], please. And I'd like to see counsel at sidebar, please. All right, we'll see you Monday. Thanks. All right, so Tori should take care of — goodbye, Margaret. Thank you.